Opinion on quality of pipe work (pictures)

[Rob567]

Hi forum

I had a new boiler put in and some pipes were put into the kitchen ceiling. I'm now in disagreement with the plumber as to whether the elbows of the plastic pipes are hanging too low. We are to plaster the ceiling but 3 separate plasterers have said its a poor job and they'll have to lower the ceiling.

Is there anyone there that can give me an objective opinion on these elbows?



Thanks

 

[Billy Bob Bob]

crap work and no way will a ceiling go flat against that,cant that plumber solder?plastic pipe and fittings disaster waiting to happen

 

[hammers4spanner]

Thats pretty pants to be fair , cant see any excuses other than lazyness

 

[Rob567]

Thanks for the replies. There was a ceiling when they he did the work. Laths and plaster. After the work was done I took the rest of the ceiling down. He says that the elbows were left so they'd fit if the ceiling was overboarded and that now "all" I need done is for the ceiling to be lowered.

 

[PlumbBobBob]

get him back to correct it to your satisfaction i.e done in copper

 

[stegas]

I always avoid plastic pipes..called out to a job years ago as they had a leak. Turned out to be on the hot water from a combi(in hep) the fitting come apart at the weekend when the house was empty and hot water was pouring out all weekend an made a right mess of the kitchen..not a happy chap. COPPER FOR ME.

 

[tamz]

It's easy to criticise others work. All i see is 3 plastic pipes and a bit copper.
If you don't like it get him back.

 

[SimonJohns]

B and q fittings. Looks like DIY to me

 

[tamz]

BandQ don't sell poly Simon

 

[Billy Bob Bob]

It's easy to criticise others work. All i see is 3 plastic pipes and a bit copper.
If you don't like it get him back.

tam i was expecting better from you,looking for words like a dogs dinner,plastic disaster LOL

 

[tamz]

As said. All i see is some plastic and a bit copper. I personally don't like plastic but the reality is it is used just as much as copper.

The checks are on the limit for the joist size. Strap the ceiling down with 2 x 1" sheet it and forget it.

 

[SimonJohns]

BandQ don't sell poly Simon

Doesn't look like poly to me. Looks like the b and q alternative to the old hep2o non demountable

 

[tamz]

It is polyplumb Simon.


Zoom it up

 

[Phil]

A plasterer just needs to screw a few battens to the bottom of the joists and board over, don't be notching joists on the bottom.

 

[stevetheplumber]

is it my eyes or have they notched the bottom of the joists ?if they have board it over quick before anyone sees it a good ds will have all the joists changed

 

[TBServices]

I don't understand how the plumber has notched the joists, clipped the pipes from underneath and even screwed a wrap over to the underside of the floorboards while the kitchen ceiling was still up. Something not right about this thread.

 

[tamz]

I don't understand how the plumber has notched the joists, clipped the pipes from underneath and even screwed a wrap over to the underside of the floorboards while the kitchen ceiling was still up. Something not right about this thread.

Exactly! The internet is a wonderful place.

Steve notches are allowed on the bottom of a joist in accordance with BS5268-2 no matter what a qs or clerk says but they are better on the top.

 

[Gray0689]

Agree it is poly plumb fittings and pipe
And whether you like plastic or not it does get used a lot I personally don't mind either way ill use copper and plastic what ever the job requires I have fitted tens of thousands of metres of underfloor heating (its still plastic pipe) and also pipe in pipe,prefer using manifolds as not overly keen on fittings

But as said it is to low for ceiling to be reinstated your installer should of drilled joints and fed it through so yes they should fix it or it will cost you a lot more to lower ceiling

 

[secret squirrel]

First of all the old argument, plastic blah blah plastic etc.

I think Tamz is spot on, easy to critise others work, the ceiling or majority was taken down after the install, we do not know what was agreed on site with the plumber or the circumstances.

Or even what conversations took place.

How many times on this forum have we had plumbers complaining about customers changing what they want, maybe it was explained to the customer about the ceiling and the customer said just leave it.

Why has the customer had more than 1 plasterer in and is now listening to them!

 

[Rob567]

The plumber removeda small portion of the ceiling to get the pipes in. I've had some plasterers in to quote for redoing the ceiling plus other work. While in they all commented on the elbows. As did the builders who were in to bring the kitchen wall down.

I was looking to this forum to help me make a decision as to whether to stop complaining and just accept what it is whilst paying a bit more for the ceiling to be lowered before plastering or to push back and insist the elbow is either moved up (something he has said will cost me half a days labour) or replace entirely with copper.

Mixed reactions here though so still not sure

 

[chris watkins]

Exactly! The internet is a wonderful place.

Steve notches are allowed on the bottom of a joist in accordance with BS5268-2 no matter what a qs or clerk says but they are better on the top.

Hi tamz I have had a quick look through BS5268-2 can't see anything about cutting underside can you point me to the appropriate section / page, please ? It may be worth putting some limitations on cutting them otherwise we may have some of the young-en's cutting a third of the way through in the middle of the span, just like I see them doing on the top of the joists.

 

[Gray0689]

No need to notch when using plastic should be drilled

 

[chris watkins]

The plumber removeda small portion of the ceiling to get the pipes in. I've had some plasterers in to quote for redoing the ceiling plus other work. While in they all commented on the elbows. As did the builders who were in to bring the kitchen wall down.

I was looking to this forum to help me make a decision as to whether to stop complaining and just accept what it is whilst paying a bit more for the ceiling to be lowered before plastering or to push back and insist the elbow is either moved up (something he has said will cost me half a days labour) or replace entirely with copper.

Mixed reactions here though so still not sure

Nothing wrong with use of plastic (it's just old plumbers moaning) unless you asked for copper.
Unless you had a conversion with your plumber as to what was going to happen to the ceiling i.e. was going to be pulled down & redone complete, then he could reasonable have carried out his work under the apprehension that the ceiling was going to be repaired by over-boarding it which is a common technique, so as long as the elbows would have been hidden by this then IMHO it is down to you.

 

[Gray0689]

Over boarding still would not of covered them elbows imho
But agree we don't know the full story we wasn't there

 

[Kev the gas]

From the pictures, why will it be massively expensive to run battens across the joists with 2x 1 ?

sounds like the plasterers are making a meal of it, :44:.

If you keep moaning about it the job will never get completed, get it done and stop moaning !

 

[nicro3]

Thanks for the replies. There was a ceiling when they he did the work. Laths and plaster. After the work was done I took the rest of the ceiling down. He says that the elbows were left so they'd fit if the ceiling was overboarded and that now "all" I need done is for the ceiling to be lowered.

Maybe the plumber thought a small bulk head would have covered the pipes. Meaning you did not need to take down the whole ceiling, just a thought!

 

[PlumbBobBob]

just another thought maybe the plumber expected your plasterer to overboard the whole ceiling on top of the lathe and plaster

 

[SimonG]

It's another one of those one sided stories. It doesn't look clever, but was it a 'cheap and cheerful' job or was it 'I want the best from a real plumber' job. A few lengths of 2 x 1 slathers lathe and reboard, job done. I don't have a problem with plastic and would have preferred to see copper but again it goes back to my point above.

 

[hammers4spanner]

Whats above the kitchen?
i cant understand why they have notched underside and dont see no felt either. I think its rough but either way why cant the plasterers board it??

 

[JCplumb]

When the original ceiling was there I'd say there was nothing wrong with this job. It's plastic but plastic is used every day without problems. I prefer copper and a lot of plumbers do, but plastic does the job and sometimes it can be the least disruptive material to use, especially where access is tight as it seems to have been here.

 

[hammers4spanner]

Dont see nothing wrong with plastic at all to be honest we all use it in drainage besides you go work most places around the p[lanet and you will see platic in most major builds wether it be push fit to electro fusion weld

 

[tamz]

Hi tamz I have had a quick look through BS5268-2 can't see anything about cutting underside can you point me to the appropriate section / page, please ? It may be worth putting some limitations on cutting them otherwise we may have some of the young-en's cutting a third of the way through in the middle of the span, just like I see them doing on the top of the joists.

2.10.9 Chris (or 6.5 in EC5 if you are good at maths) but like reading our standards nothing is ever totally clear. It is easier to follow Trada guidelines which are below with a nice wee drawing.
Btw, cutting notches at a slope places less stress on the timber.

 

[woodsy]

As said by others, regardless of whether you like plastic or not, it appears to be a one sided tale to me and i personally don't like slagging somebody off without all the facts which i don't feel we have got. The pipes should of been drilled through the joist and hidden but if the installer wasn't told that taking down the ceiling was an option then how can we criticise. Been on the end of one of these type of tales and its really annoying to say the least.

 

[chris watkins]

2.10.9 Chris (or 6.5 in EC5 if you are good at maths) but like reading our standards nothing is ever totally clear. It is easier to follow Trada guidelines which are below with a nice wee drawing.
Btw, cutting notches at a slope places less stress on the timber.

As we always say "we live & learn" thanks tamz, the 1/8 - 1/4 of the depth & the zoneing are well published (BS 6700, 8000 & building regs to name just a few) but I have never seen it stated bottom as well as top.
I always thought because the joists were under compression the underside would be pulling apart & therefore more effected if notched but clearly not so great an effect if kept close to the ends.
Nice one !!!

 

[Mike Jackson]

I's always assumed that you shouldn't notch the bottom for the same reason but a spot of googling reveals loads of information stating that it's okay as long as you don't notch top and bottom at the same end.