Compression joints

[oldnorm]

What is the correct way to make a compression joint? There are various views on whether sealing compound should be used or not. I want to replace a defective compression joint water valve which has 3 ports. From past experience, when I dismantle it the original tight fitting olives will remain in place. Should these be removed and new ones fitted. The valve is fitted in a very confined space which makes using a saw to remove olives difficult.
Help would be appreciated.

Thank you.

 

[TomLane]

Use one of these to remove the olive

Where was leak from previously? Via the thread on the joint or around the pipe?

Do you mean the connection is a Tee piece?

 

[PlumbBobBob]

hi oldnorm welcome to the forums. yes you can use sealing compound if you wish, or a couple of wraps of ptfe tape around the olives. how old is the fitting you are replacing? the reason i ask is that the thread may be different also the dimensions of the valve may be slightly different to the new one. can you post a picture of the offending article?

 

[supper plumb]

ptfe on the olive jointing compound not used on portable water or use lock tight on the tread

 

[dancinplumba]

View attachment 14932
ptfe on the olive jointing compound not used on portable water or use lock tight on the tread

Rubbish

 

[PlumbBobBob]

i've got that olive cutter. you can get jointing compounds that you can use on potable water.

 

[Masood]

jointing compound not used on portable water

Really?

https://www.google.co.uk/#q=potable+water+jointing+compound

 

[supper plumb]

my bad sorry i st dont use it only use ptfe

 

[Phil]

There's a lot of nasty fittings going around made in a far away land where they eat fried duck heads and scorpions for snacks.
These fittings need a good smear of Water Hawk otherwise they will fail you.

 

[supper plumb]

But who is selling them phil so we can all buy some along with a tub of water hawk

 

[Phil]

I found a sealed bag of x2 comp 15mm elbows from 'Doitall' ...anyone remember them? in my dads shed, they were genuine Conex fittings and were 59p.

Those days are gone.........

 

[supper plumb]

I know a plumber who has his garden and massive summer house/shed full of plumbing stuff from well you name it he probs got it i almost come in my boxers all the tools and fitting parts etc

 

[Centralheatking]

This is the way I look at this - it is a problem.

1. There are two sorts of compression nut/fitting body etc
which can be either chrome or brass BOTH almost do the job of each other but will leak
without and including overtightening if they are not compatible. You can usuaually tell
when starting the tread off by hand.

2. Jointing materail 1. Some do it dry 2. some use ptfe 3. some use splodge compound
they all work some even splodge silicone in ! - I often think it does not matter

Boss White ( after a few days with the top off is ace) boss green is so coarse
and expensive i hate it - yellow splodge for gas. Old men use plaster and hemp !

centralheatking

 

[oldnorm]

Thank you for your comments. It was obvious that some of you did not read my thread carefully. No way can I remove olives using the large tools shown as I have a confined space under floorboards. The 3 way water valve does not leak but has problem going the full turn without sticking and stripping the actuator gears that drive it. I suspect the ceramic inside the valve has been coated with dirt particles in the water over the yearr.Although very old, I do have a direct replacement , a Switchmaster 3 port valve put by to install - all brass. I will take note of your comments when replacing it. I may be forced to leave the old olives in situ if I can't file them off with a miniature hacksaw and hope PTFE tape will do it's job. Thanks again.
PS I'm still not sure how to use the web site to generate posts so I hope I have done the right thing in the way I have responded.

 

[Dotty]

Oldnorm. Olive breakers are tiny. If there's room for your grips then there's plenty of room for that tool.

 

[Centralheatking]

Ok we did not read your original thread but then having gone over it agian
all you need is a junior hacksaw - and strong fingers

I am R/hand - put the hacksaw in your left hand cut backwards and fwds carefully
diagonally accross the olive WITHOUT going into the copper pipe or fitting. When
you are happy get a flat head screwdriver and put it into your cut - turnclockwise
and hey presto - this works for 22mm/3/4 inch and 15mm/1/2 inch - etc.

centralheatking

Thank you for your comments. It was obvious that some of you did not read my thread carefully. No way can I remove olives using the large tools shown as I have a confined space under floorboards. The 3 way water valve does not leak but has problem going the full turn without sticking and stripping the actuator gears that drive it. I suspect the ceramic inside the valve has been coated with dirt particles in the water over the yearr.Although very old, I do have a direct replacement , a Switchmaster 3 port valve put by to install - all brass. I will take note of your comments when replacing it. I may be forced to leave the old olives in situ if I can't file them off with a miniature hacksaw and hope PTFE tape will do it's job. Thanks again.
PS I'm still not sure how to use the web site to generate posts so I hope I have done the right thing in the way I have responded.

 

[BN9Pete]

View attachment 14932
ptfe on the olive jointing compound not used on portable water or use lock tight on the tread

What is lock tight?
What is PORTABLE water?

 

[kay-jay]

What is lock tight?
What is PORTABLE water?

Portable water is water in a bucket

 

[dancinplumba]

Thank you for your comments. It was obvious that some of you did not read my thread carefully. No way can I remove olives using the large tools shown as I have a confined space under floorboards. The 3 way water valve does not leak but has problem going the full turn without sticking and stripping the actuator gears that drive it. I suspect the ceramic inside the valve has been coated with dirt particles in the water over the yearr.Although very old, I do have a direct replacement , a Switchmaster 3 port valve put by to install - all brass. I will take note of your comments when replacing it. I may be forced to leave the old olives in situ if I can't file them off with a miniature hacksaw and hope PTFE tape will do it's job. Thanks again.
PS I'm still not sure how to use the web site to generate posts so I hope I have done the right thing in the way I have responded.

Best to call in a professional

 

[dancinplumba]

What is lock tight?
What is PORTABLE water?

Think lock tight is a key

 

[TomLane]

I did indeed misread some of your thread, I assumed you were describing a tee connection as you said it was under the floorboards. But you also said there was little room for a saw, no mention of room for smaller tools, hence why I mentioned the olive puller. If the space is really that limited, this might be of some use if you really must do the job yourself & risk causing further problems.

For the others viewing this thread who regularly post on here why would one of these valves be under the floorboards?!? Bodged or deliberate?

 

[rpm]

I was once told never use chrome nuts on brass fittings or vice versa, any truth in this people or is it something to do with brass / copper olives and chrome fittings, not talking about chrome pipe here just good old fashioned copper pipe.

 

[woodytheplumber]

i have never yet had a olive i couldnt remove with my grips i have never used an olive puller and dont think i will be buying one

 

[Ermintrude]

All those olive pullers / cutters are gash! Bit like a microbore pipe slice!

1. Buy monument olive cutter or

2. Set adjustable to just over dia of tube, put behind nut and slid along tube with force and off pops the nut and olive. Or cut olive - u might mark tube then u have a problem.

Seal joint with jet blue paste.

 

[happyflyer]

Use one of these to remove the olive

Where was leak from previously? Via the thread on the joint or around the pipe?

Do you mean the connection is a Tee piece?

Wow Tom how much was that, junior hacksaw very carefully part way through the olive and a screwdriver in the cut and twist, cut through at 45 deg across the olive, do the three in 3 mins, you will be lucky if you can get that machine in the gap

 

[supper plumb]

WRAS approved, potable, ready-to-use jointing compounds which are ideal for general use on compression joints, screw fittings as well as acting as external leak sealers.

 

[TomLane]

Wow Tom how much was that, junior hacksaw very carefully part way through the olive and a screwdriver in the cut and twist, cut through at 45 deg across the olive, do the three in 3 mins, you will be lucky if you can get that machine in the gap

Not sure, never bought one, I "acquired" mine. Used someone else's previously to owning one as I was interested as to how it worked. It fits in the palm of your hand & does 22mm & 15mm so isn't overly large. It obviously won't fit in the smallest of gaps unfortunately. It has it's uses where you can't pull off the olive with grips, or by whacking the nut to force it off, or by cutting the olive or even cutting a short length of pipe off!

 

[Markus]

Personally if pipes and olives sound and new fitting snug a wrap with ptfe is usually good shout.

 

[AWheating]

as above, if the new fitting suits the old nuts and olives then rap with ptfe and tighten back up.

if you need to remove the olives then use some grips, if they wont work off use a junior and small screwdriver.

worse case cut back and solder/comp couple some new bits of pipe.

if you think we are mind readers and know how much room you have well great, but why not post a picture instead. Saves you having to complain we dont know what your asking.

 

[SimonG]

Thank you for your comments. It was obvious that some of you did not read my thread carefully. No way can I remove olives using the large tools shown as I have a confined space under floorboards. The 3 way water valve does not leak but has problem going the full turn without sticking and stripping the actuator gears that drive it. I suspect the ceramic inside the valve has been coated with dirt particles in the water over the yearr.Although very old, I do have a direct replacement , a Switchmaster 3 port valve put by to install - all brass. I will take note of your comments when replacing it. I may be forced to leave the old olives in situ if I can't file them off with a miniature hacksaw and hope PTFE tape will do it's job. Thanks again.
PS I'm still not sure how to use the web site to generate posts so I hope I have done the right thing in the way I have responded.

That's the magic of plumbing, in impossible spaces achieving miracles.

Forget the switchmaster and get a Honeywell valve and head put in. Don't forget to get some inhibitor into the system otherwise your new three port won't last very long.

Hacksaw so far through the olives and then split it with a flat head screwdriver. Fit the new nuts and olives and paste should suffice, unless somebody has wrung the life out the nuts previously, then I'd be giving a few wraps of ptfe and paste.