loss of bar pressure in two days - no leak anywhere. Logic 30 Boiler

[kx07fdp]

Hi
I'm at a loss as to what the problem could be with my Logic 30 boiler.

I've had a problem which has the bar pressure dropping to zero within 2 days.
I've had the floorboards up and been crawling under the floor to check all pipework which shows no signs of leaking.
The radiators have been bleed and show no signs of leaking.
After reading somewhere that I should turn the taps off under the boiler to isolate the boiler and radiators. This was to see if the problem lay at the boiler end or radiators. The pressure is still dropping when the boiler was turned off and therefore I assume the problem must be at the boiler end.
Again, someone suggested the pressure relief valve was possibly damaged - I understand this hasnt been changed but was cleaned recently with no signs of dirt etc.
My question is obviously, what could the problem be and at what cost would it be to rectify the fault.
Also how much water must be lost to go from 1.5 bar to zero?
The pipework outside the house (from pressure relief valve) shows no signs of any water on the brickwork.
The front of the boiler has been taken off while the electric is off and there is no signs of water in the boiler area but the pressure is still dropping. The boiler is only about 3 years old too.
Cheers Chris
Newcastle upon tyne

 

[Simon F]

is there water passing down the condense pipe when the heating is cold?
sounds like time to call an engineer to diagnose and fix

 

[kx07fdp]

is there water passing down the condense pipe when the heating is cold?
sounds like time to call an engineer to diagnose and fix

Cheers - I'll wrap a plastic bag around the end and check tomorrow - ta.

 

[kx07fdp]

Cheers - I'll wrap a plastic bag around the end and check tomorrow - ta.

I've had my father around today (he's a retired plumber who can't work out this fault). He's attached a second pressure gauge to a pipe downstairs (it's actually the furthest point away from boiler). I've had the system on cold for around 5 hours now and the boiler gauge has dropped (not as much as when the central heating system is running), but it has definitely dropped.
However, the gauge downstairs hasn't moved. He assumed that both gauges would drop or not at all.
My father has had very little to do with combi boilers or boilers in general for the last 10 years or so and he's drawn a blank on where the leak can be.
I've got plastic bags on the ends of the condensate pipe and also the pipe which runs from the pressure relief valve (to outside the home).
I've had a telephone call from someone from ratedpeople.com who thinks the job can be fixed for under a £100 with the information I've given, but I'd like to know where the fault could be before I decide to say yes.
Cheers
Chris

 

[dancinplumba]

simon f said the condense pipe not the safety discharge, it sounds like your hex is buggered, get a qualified, gas safe heating installer to look at it for you

 

[dancinplumba]

also did you isolate boiler from system ??

 

[kx07fdp]

simon f said the condense pipe not the safety discharge, it sounds like your hex is buggered, get a qualified, gas safe heating installer to look at it for you

Hi - thanks very much for reply.
I've only just got back down from garage roof and Simon was spot on.....the bag which was taped to the condense pipe was full of water. It's lost about half a cup in 5 hours.
We've had a fault with the boiler recently which had a blocked condensate trap. The boiler wouldn't fire up - I understand the trap has now been fully cleaned as we've had no problems with the boiler actually starting.
I think I've carried out all I can do legally so I think your right....time for a installer. Cheers

Any local guys from Newcastle upon tyne fancy a quote on this?

 

[payney1974]

Hi - thanks very much for reply.
I've only just got back down from garage roof and Simon was spot on.....the bag which was taped to the condense pipe was full of water. It's lost about half a cup in 5 hours.
We've had a fault with the boiler recently which had a blocked condensate trap. The boiler wouldn't fire up - I understand the trap has now been fully cleaned as we've had no problems with the boiler actually starting.
I think I've carried out all I can do legally so I think your right....time for a installer. Cheers

Any local guys from Newcastle upon tyne fancy a quote on this?

Its worth ringing Ideal if the heat exchangers gone after only 3 years on their Logic, they might change it as a goodwill gesture. They dont want anymore bad press after their previous range!!

 

[aligorgon]

Did you use the ho****er in those hrs you had the heating off or did you turn the power off to the boiler?

 

[kx07fdp]

Did you use the ho****er in those hrs you had the heating off or did you turn the power off to the boiler?

Power off.

 

[kx07fdp]

Its worth ringing Ideal if the heat exchangers gone after only 3 years on their Logic, they might change it as a goodwill gesture. They dont want anymore bad press after their previous range!!

Thanks for that - email already sent...you never know

 

[kx07fdp]

I assume you mean heat exchange when you are saying HEX (?)....Just priced one for about £40 so if it is that I assume it wouldn't be too much for the completed job. Like I say, anyone in Newcastle area want to give me a quote just private message me. Cheers.

 

[payney1974]

I assume you mean heat exchange when you are saying HEX (?)....Just priced one for about £40 so if it is that I assume it wouldn't be too much for the completed job. Like I say, anyone in Newcastle area want to give me a quote just private message me. Cheers.

£40? Are you sure?

 

[kx07fdp]

£40? Are you sure?

Ideal 175418 Plate Heat Exchanger Kit - Ideal Spare Parts

Heating Spare Parts | 24 Hour Delivery

Think one or two have sold on Ebay for £20 recently too.

Is that the correct part?
The Heat engine is £250+ . is that a different part or part of the exchange?

 

[payney1974]

Ideal 175418 Plate Heat Exchanger Kit - Ideal Spare Parts

Heating Spare Parts | 24 Hour Delivery

Think one or two have sold on Ebay for £20 recently too.

Is that the correct part?
The Heat engine is £250+ . is that a different part or part of the exchange?

If its leaking through the condense it will be the heat engine, if the leak is in the plate the pressure probably wouldnt drop it would rise.

 

[kx07fdp]

If its leaking through the condense it will be the heat engine, if the leak is in the plate the pressure probably wouldnt drop it would rise.

Thank you
Hopefully Ideal will change free of charge. cheers again

 

[kx07fdp]

Just to end this thread - I've had a reply from Ideal and they are fixing the boiler free of charge. The guy came out this week and confirmed it was the heat exchange. New part has been ordered and will be fitted on Monday (out of warranty but free of charge).
Anyone thats followed this thread or has ended up here while searching for Ideal or Logic help will hopefully find that you can get boilers fixed out of warranty - I just quoted the "sales of goods act".
Cheers again for the replies.
Much appreciated!!!!!!

 

[Barry98]

Thanks for taking the time to come back and let us know the out come