Gas valve for hob behind cupboard.

[Matt0029]

When installing a gas hob the required isolation valve usually falls behind the cooker. That is removed by unscrewing 4 screws. I'm wondering if its seen acceptable by most to use a compression gas isolation valve in such a position. . Thanks

 

[Harvest Fields]

Never, as it is then inaccessible and it needs moving so that it can be turned off by the owner/tenant.

 

[Scott_D]

It’s not an end user valve, they would shut off the ECV in an emergency.
Fine to use a compression valve.

I was told this on a gas safe inspection

 

[Harvest Fields]

It’s not an end user valve, they would shut off the ECV in an emergency.
Fine to use a compression valve.

I was told this on a gas safe inspection

It is actually a service valve. If I’m honest.

 

[Harvest Fields]

It’s not an end user valve, they would shut off the ECV in an emergency.
Fine to use a compression valve.

I was told this on a gas safe inspection

You cannot use a compression valve on gas that isn’t accessible mate. The oven is screwed in which means not accessible.

 

[townfanjon]

You cannot use a compression valve on gas that isn’t accessible mate. The oven is screwed in which means not accessible.

Says who ?
Only time you cant use compression is under a floor

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Fine behind the oven

 

[Harvest Fields]

Says who ?
Only time you cant use compression is under a floor

My training centre.

 

[townfanjon]

My training centre.

Yer I find training centers make their own rules

 

[Scott_D]

You cannot use a compression valve on gas that isn’t accessible mate. The oven is screwed in which means not accessible.

By removal of 4 screws it becomes accessible
A gas meter and ECV are not accessible without a cupboard key

 

[Harvest Fields]

By removal of 4 screws it becomes accessible
A gas meter and ECV are not accessible without a cupboard key

Accessible is when you do not need a screwdriver to gain access.

 

[Harvest Fields]

My training centre.

Maybe. But it is what I was taught.

 

[Harvest Fields]

These Hob installation instructions also say that the isolation valve should be accessible. This is the same pic that I posted in the other thread.

 

[Sharp Point]

But what would take longer, removing 4 screws or emptying 3 drawers full of pans and pottery or food tins/boxes? For as long as mans been installing integrated units, a gas cock has been behind a under worktop oven... gas or electric.
Like you said, it’s for servicing for a gas safe engineer.

 

[Harvest Fields]

I know and I get where you are coming from.

 

[Sharp Point]

I know and I get where you are coming from.

I see where you’re coming from HF, but I think the aim of this trade is to work practically... although it may need a slight curvature of the rules

 

[Deleted member 32524]

I have also been taught compression is not acceptable.

 

[Last Plumber]

How do we define 'accessible'?

That's all it needs to be to be able to use compression on Gas.

It is up to the on site Engineers discretion to define that, in that particular situation.

It's not always easy to make your mind up though, lol.

 

[Aire]

How do we define 'accessible'?

That's all it needs to be to be able to use compression on Gas.

It is up to the on site Engineers discretion to define that, in that particular situation.

It's not always easy to make your mind up though, lol.

I'd define something accessible if you can get it easily by using basic hand tools. A screwdriver to remove 4 screws and pull an oven out would be accessible in my opinion.

 

[Harvest Fields]

I'd define something accessible if you can get it easily by using basic hand tools. A screwdriver to remove 4 screws and pull an oven out would be accessible in my opinion.

So then why doesn’t that count for flues in voids why can they not be screwed. Why do they have to be proper hatches?

 

[Sharp Point]

So then why doesn’t that count for flues in voids why can they not be screwed. Why do they have to be proper hatches?

I’d imagine that a customer allowing internal decoration to be damaged from removing screw or even finding screws under wallpaper, would be very difficult. Where as purpose built hatches are easily accessible and hard to wall paper over

 

[Aire]

So then why doesn’t that count for flues in voids why can they not be screwed. Why do they have to be proper hatches?

Dont hatches only apply to flues that are inaccessible? That would again come down the engineer, if I came to a flue where the boxing could easily be removed by taking out a few screws I wouldn't class that flue as inaccessible.

 

[Harvest Fields]

I’d imagine that a customer allowing internal decoration to be damaged from removing screw or even finding screws under wallpaper, would be very difficult. Where as purpose built hatches are easily accessible and hard to wall paper over

But you could damage the oven or cupboard by removing the oven? Six of one and half a dozen of the other me thinks.

 

[Sharp Point]

Dont hatches only apply to flues that are inaccessible? That would again come down the engineer, if I came to a flue where the boxing could easily be removed by taking out a few screws I wouldn't class that flue as inaccessible.

Lol, you tell Mrs Smith down the road, that you want to remove her 2 month old painted and caulked boxing.

You’ll get a quick feckoffski....

 

[Harvest Fields]

Lol, you tell Mrs Smith down the road, that you want to remove her 2 month old painted and caulked boxing.

You’ll get a quick feckoffski..

Just saying I don’t see the difference.

 

[Aire]

Lol, you tell Mrs Smith down the road, that you want to remove her 2 month old painted and caulked boxing.

You’ll get a quick feckoffski..

But I wouldn't class that as accessible as the boxing would be classed as permanent.

 

[Sharp Point]

But I wouldn't class that as accessible as the boxing would be classed as permanent.

The scenario is ‘ the boxing has screws in it too’ covered in lovely fresh two month old paint, but to remove the panels, would require cutting the caulk and damaging the painted screw heads

 

[Harvest Fields]

The scenario is ‘ the boxing has screws in it too’ covered in lovely fresh two month old paint, but to remove the panels, would require cutting the caulk and damaging the painted screw heads

Instead of a brand be £700 electric oven she has just had fitted and you need to remove it to get to the gas tap for the hob.

 

[Aire]

The scenario is ‘ the boxing has screws in it too’ covered in lovely fresh two month old paint, but to remove the panels, would require cutting the caulk and damaging the painted screw heads

But again this all comes down to the engineer, there is nothing concrete saying access hatches have to be used, if you can remove the boxing in a reasonable amount of time and without damaging any decor then I wouldn't personally say an access hatch is required.

 

[Sharp Point]

Instead of a brand be £700 electric oven she has just had fitted and you need to remove it to get to the gas tap for the hob.

Yep, I get what you mean HF. But really, how many times do you isolate the gas cock to work on it? I bet you turn off the ECV to stop the gas.
I all honesty, they’re just another item waiting to leak, when the grease dries up.... waste of time and money

 

[Last Plumber]

I think that behind an inbuilt cooker is accessible.
I would use a compression Gas cock in that position.
These ovens are easily removed normally and by one man too.
I can have one out in less than two minutes but if it is a worry, put the Gas cock behind the next cupboard and drill a hole in that so it is visible.
When all is said and done the connection to the hob provided by manufacturers is a face joint with a fibre washer on one side and a male taper thread the other side. I know I have seen more leaking joints up there than leaking Gas cocks. Again, Engineers discretion.
At the end of the day there is no list of what is accessible or not.
It is the same for sparks. They can use joint boxes as long as they are accessible. Most of those are beneath carpets and floor boards with no clue of where they are. At least with a hob you can suspect that there is something to isolate it somewhere behind one of the cupboards.