Stripped gland or bonnet nut on cartridge gate valve

[DIYplumberWhitby]

I have a gate valve that shuts water off to outside hose bib, and it leaks through the valve stem when open. The valve was installed 25 years ago when the house was new, and is used seasonally to shut water off to the outside hose bib to prevent the hose bib from being damaged during winter freeze. I have recently acquired a replacement cartridge as this gate value is not the type that has a packing nut in order to fix the leak, and the bonnet or gland nut is a really odd size. It is larger than 16mm, but smaller than 17mm, and larger than 5/8" and smaller than 11/16". It is making me crazy. I've tried spanners (crescent wrench) of all these sizes, and stilsons (pipe wrench), and mole grips (vice grips), and even a deep 17mm socket on a compact drill ... and yes, I managed to strip the nut. I used WD-40 on it, three times, and let is sit over night each time. I've tapped on it. I put a pipe wrench with opposing force on the body of the valve when doing all of this so I wouldn't twist the copper pipe it sits on. I have not tried heat yet, but I guess that is next. I also will try to file the stripped nut to try to re-construct flats for the spanners. I am also thinking of buying 10" Knipex Cobra pliers. Any other ideas? I'd really rather not cut the pipe above and below the valve and just replace the whole thing, especially as I think the valve body is fine and I have the replacement cartridge sitting here just waiting to be installed. Any thoughts on how to unstick this stuck bonnet / gland nut?

 

[Roy_66]

Can you add a photo please.

Cheers,
Roy (Amateur)

 

[Deleted member 120897]

If you’ve stripped/rounded it off, then it’s unlikely you’ll get it out, especially if all other methods have failed. You could add a photo as Roy suggests, but I’d suggest replacing it for that reason and the fact gate valves aren’t recommended for mains pressure (if that’s what it is).

 

[DIYplumberWhitby]

Thanks for the replies! @Roy_66 @Undertrained Photo attached. The stripped bonnet is just to the left of the etched symbol, which itself is just left of the relief. The line to the left of the etched symbol is where you can also see where the cartridge meets the valve body. There is a nut holding the handle on, and removing that and the handle lets me get a deep socket on the nut itself. The second pic is the new replacement cartridge.

 

[Deleted member 120897]

The cartridge you have bought to replace it I doubt will fit. This is what a gate valve inside looks like:

Probably best replacing with something like this:

Made4Trade Lever Ball Valve

• Full bore

www.toolstation.com

 

[DIYplumberWhitby]

Thanks for the replies! @Roy_66 @Undertrained Photo attached. The stripped bonnet is just to the left of the etched symbol, which itself is just left of the relief. The line to the left of the etched symbol is where you can also see where the cartridge meets the valve body. There is a nut holding the handle on, and removing that and the handle lets me get a deep socket on the nut itself. The second pic is the new replacement cartridge.

Sorry - I meant "stop" valve. This stop valve is within the house, downstream from the main shutoff, and turns water off to the outside house bib.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

If it’s 3/4 NOS AY MCDONALD MFG 3/4" SWEAT BRASS GATE VALVE WITH BLEEDER KB | eBay - https://www.ebay.com/itm/262775304172

 

[Ric2013]

The one with a rubber washer is called a stopcock, not a stop valve (in England, anyway - EDIT - just noticed you aren't in England - I was thinking Whitby in Yorkshire), but what you have really does look to be a gate valve. It makes sense to replace it, sorry. Unless by some stroke of luck you can fit the new head around the existing valve stem (same diameter?) and the threads all match.

I think application of heat is going to be your only chance, but will only really work if you drain the pipe first. Worth a shot if you have the time and nothing else to do with it.

They aren't generally used on mains pressure any more, but modern high quality ones e.g. Pegler probably would work (the cheap ones don't seal properly on mains pressure). But may as well replace with a BS1010 stopcock (EDIT - British Standards won't apply to Ontario) or a lever ball valve as above.

I'm intrigued as to what that thing on the side of your valve is. Looks like some kind of knurned nut.

EDIT Just realised what the OP has could be a GLOBE not GATE valve. A globe valve has a rising spindle (goes up and down as it screws in and out) and is a bit like a stopcock without a rubber seal. It is directional (a gate valve isn't). Can be used (so they say) for regulating flow without wearing out unlike gate valves which shouldn't be used for that purpose (although lots of us do...). Only seen one once but it didn't seal properly (and Pegler does not recommend them (unlike Gate valves) for end of line service at all).

 

[DIYplumberWhitby]

The one with a rubber washer is called a stopcock, not a stop valve (in England, anyway - EDIT - just noticed you aren't in England - I was thinking Whitby in Yorkshire), but what you have really does look to be a gate valve. It makes sense to replace it, sorry. Unless by some stroke of luck you can fit the new head around the existing valve stem (same diameter?) and the threads all match.

I think application of heat is going to be your only chance, but will only really work if you drain the pipe first. Worth a shot if you have the time and nothing else to do with it.

They aren't generally used on mains pressure any more, but modern high quality ones e.g. Pegler probably would work (the cheap ones don't seal properly on mains pressure). But may as well replace with a BS1010 stopcock (EDIT - British Standards won't apply to Ontario) or a lever ball valve as above.

I'm intrigued as to what that thing on the side of your valve is. Looks like some kind of knurned nut.

EDIT Just realised what the OP has could be a GLOBE not GATE valve. A globe valve has a rising spindle (goes up and down as it screws in and out) and is a bit like a stopcock without a rubber seal. It is directional (a gate valve isn't). Can be used (so they say) for regulating flow without wearing out unlike gate valves which shouldn't be used for that purpose (although lots of us do...). Only seen one once but it didn't seal properly (and Pegler does not recommend them (unlike Gate valves) for end of line service at all).

I believe you are right on both - Whitby Ontario Canada ... and GLOBE valve. I'm trying to remove the faulty (stripped) cartridge and replace it with the new one. Will try heat as next step. Not entirely sure how to grip the stripped nut though, but maybe file it a bit and try mole grips again.

 

[DIYplumberWhitby]

The cartridge you have bought to replace it I doubt will fit. This is what a gate valve inside looks like:

View attachment 65861
Probably best replacing with something like this:

Made4Trade Lever Ball Valve

• Full bore

www.toolstation.com

I unfortunately can't edit my starting post, but I believe my valve is actually a GLOBE valve (per Ric2013 post later on).