Pressure Test Q's

[AWheating]

looking at the pics id say the system was installed by a right donkey. Personally i would insist on a full repipe. When i worked on new build we would always pressure test and require the builder to witness the test and a signed certificate would be issued with the plumber and builders details much like a gas certificate.

Do you have the boiler benchmark book? does it indicate that chemicals were used in the heating system?

 

[bengasman]

If the whole estate is this bad, you should consider taking collective action. Make it clear to the builders that if they don't bring it up to spec real soon, they will face "class action" and be forced to pay huge legal fees on top of the undoubted outcome.

 

[fagsanbooz]

awheating is right, we always had to get 'test certificates' signed by either 'clerk of works', 'site manager', a council building controlofficer or an independant bco, which on new housing sites is normally nhbc inspector/rep. Water regulations state; all new installations must be pressure tested to at least 1.5 times the expected working pressure for an hour or for different periods of time if plastic. Any plumber can do this with a test pump and some water.
personally would keep on at nhbc for documentation and certificates, they are the ones 'verifying' workmanship and conformity!
I know you dont want to but, i'd consider getting an independent industry expert (maybe CIPHE would be worth a call) and the manufacturers to compile reports and testimonies. Then hit them with it and demand some action.

 

[wiseman]

Must have been a right numpty uponor is pretty much fail safe..im guessing its a joint not crimped/pushed in to the viewing window; as if in a tight spot the rubber can still hold a decent pressure.
That rad nut must be finger tight to be leaking haha. Deff replumb. I cant believe buildings can be signed off in this state. :/

 

[AWheating]

i have worked on new builds where they were signed off on pre plaster inspection and the inspector never even went into the property. Even known stuffed envolopes be exchanged to get around issues.

 

[Maitri]

Hi guys incredibly I am still without heating / hot water! However, builder now offering to try to do something! So some Q's if anyone can help.

NHBC told builder to carry out repairs to radiators where pipework to valves is leaking and then pressure test. They say "the pressure test should be carried out by an Independent Specialist how had not previously been involved with the original installation. The Specialist should produce a Report confirming the test carried out and whether it passes or fails and recomendations if necessary. A copy of the Report should be sent to the Homeowner and NHBC. NHBC reserve the rights to accept the Report in whole or in part. If it rejects any part of the Report we can engage our own Specialists. "

OK Q's:

1. what will happen if the system is dirty and it is pressure tested ? (Boiler was "chock-a-block with swarf and sludge" which is what initiated this particular saga).
2. can a system be pressure tested and left in working order if the boiler doesn't work because of swarf/sludge due to it not being commissioned from new?
3. what happens if the system starts to leak when joints are not accessible which is what gave rise to properties having to be re-plumbed as a leak below floor level was impossible to find!
4. could pressure testing to 4 bar weaken and thereby exacerbate potential problems with a defective system even if problems didn't show up immediately? We know the property that had to re-plumbed kept losing pressure to the boiler (only a small leak) not traceable. So is it possible that pressure testing a defective system, even if there isn't an immediate problem, could cause more problems?

Thanks

 

[stevetheplumber]

crap job this is what you get when you pay rock bottom wages the pipe work isnt a system ive heard of but seems strange a crimp system then goes into compression fittings

 

[dontknowitall]

Hi guys incredibly I am still without heating / hot water! However, builder now offering to try to do something! So some Q's if anyone can help.

NHBC told builder to carry out repairs to radiators where pipework to valves is leaking and then pressure test. They say "the pressure test should be carried out by an Independent Specialist how had not previously been involved with the original installation. The Specialist should produce a Report confirming the test carried out and whether it passes or fails and recomendations if necessary. A copy of the Report should be sent to the Homeowner and NHBC. NHBC reserve the rights to accept the Report in whole or in part. If it rejects any part of the Report we can engage our own Specialists. "

OK Q's:

1. what will happen if the system is dirty and it is pressure tested ? (Boiler was "chock-a-block with swarf and sludge" which is what initiated this particular saga).
2. can a system be pressure tested and left in working order if the boiler doesn't work because of swarf/sludge due to it not being commissioned from new?
3. what happens if the system starts to leak when joints are not accessible which is what gave rise to properties having to be re-plumbed as a leak below floor level was impossible to find!
4. could pressure testing to 4 bar weaken and thereby exacerbate potential problems with a defective system even if problems didn't show up immediately? We know the property that had to re-plumbed kept losing pressure to the boiler (only a small leak) not traceable. So is it possible that pressure testing a defective system, even if there isn't an immediate problem, could cause more problems?

Thanks

Poor you! Not all plumbers work like this but most of us do get leaks from time to time and 99% of the time they're fixed by the end of the job and the 1% fixed by a return visit. Water can be most annoying sometimes, even for us!

My answers are not necessarily official but they're my view:

1. Nothing that will impair a pressure test.
2. Not sure what you mean but you can disconnect a boiler to pressure test the rest of the system.
3. If a leak is from an inaccessible joint, it has to be accessed or it will continue leaking.
4. I *think* WRAS approved products have to withstand 10bar of pressure. A pressure test (from memory) has to be held at 1½ times working pressure for an hour. So 1 bar working pressure has to be tested at 1.5 bar for an hour. Or 2.5 bar for 1/2 hour. Or 5 bar for 1/4 hour.

Pressure testing could cause further problems in the same way that running a car at maximum revs for too long can cause further problems.

I don't know if you have access to legal aid but it might be worth considering threatening legal action. The NHBC really should be sorting this out as a matter of course but it seems as they're not being particularly helpful. A letter from a solicitor might Gee things up.

Hope you get this sorted before too long but, I'm afraid, I can't see this being sorted out within a couple of weeks or so.

 

[andyplumber]

have you had the water in the heating tested with a fernox test kit as that will tell you the condition of the water all you do is take a sample of your mains cold water and a sample of your heating water and send it back to fernox and they will test it, it might be a way of proving that no chemicals was put in and then you can present that to NHBC.

 

[ADM360]

Hi you mentioned that D&G engineer suspected that the boiler was not commisioned!! you should have somewhere the boiler instructions and log book which should have the bench mark in it and service record, also the gas certificate from the engineer that installed it also, it should have been logged with building control at the time of instalation. if you do not have this and the builder can not produce it or have a record of it, then this could be in breach of GSUIR, as new appliance/installation MUST NOT be left connected to the gas supply. if an appliance can not be fully commissioned. if this is the case, the it would be deamed as a immediatly dangerous situation! which could in turn be reportable to the HSE and possibly to RIDDOR as it could be classed as poor workmanship. I would have thought the NHBC would be aware of this! also letting the builder know this could move him along to sort out your problems as most builders would not like a HSE investigation! the problem of cause may lie with the fact you are the second house holder and he could try the it was all with the first! but he should have some records as it is only 2 years ago, also building control should have a record, Hope this helps.