Plastic or Copper piping?

[petercj]

Agreed. Plastic has its place, especially for heating systems in new builds. The problem with plastic is it's perception by non-plumbers, who think that soldering is the hardest part of the job (lol) so therefore, plastic pipe means they are instantly competent plumbers.

On a side note, please correct me if i'm wrong, but i thought that sludge in a system was a byproduct of the reaction of ferrous, non-ferrous metals, moisture and air within a heating system, which the inhibitor, well, inhibited. Therefore, less copper = less sludge?


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Magnetite aka sludge (the black stuff) is produced by steel/iron radiators

 

[TBServices]

Magnetite aka sludge (the black stuff) is produced by steel/iron radiators

Yes, but is it not the chemical difference between the copper and the steel that creates the magnetite? I can't remember where I picked this up, probably from college.


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[petercj]

Yes, but is it not the chemical difference between the copper and the steel that creates the magnetite? I can't remember where I picked this up, probably from college.


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Magnetite in radiators is a product of corrosion, and the more oxygen there is in the water the faster the process will be - IF plastic pipe did allow air to pass, then that would explain excessive sludging. I've never heard that plastic will reduce the tendency for magnetite to form.

 

[SimonG]

Nowt wrong with plastic, when installed correctly. Trouble is most of the time it's thrown in by people who don't read the mi's. It's a nice addition to the arsenal and has it's place. I only have two issues with plastic, vermin chewing it and muppets installing it incorrectly.

Was there all this commotion when we went from lead to copper?

 

[TBServices]

Magnetite in radiators is a product of corrosion, and the more oxygen there is in the water the faster the process will be - IF plastic pipe did allow air to pass, then that would explain excessive sludging. I've never heard that plastic will reduce the tendency for magnetite to form.

Right, hence the barrier. So when we're talking about excessive buildup here, we're on the assumption of using the incorrect pipe.


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[DirksPlumbing]

Right, hence the barrier. So when we're talking about excessive buildup here, we're on the assumption of using the incorrect pipe.

Well yes but no. The barrier is only hindering the process of oxygen intrusion. It is not a stop. If we are talking about excessive sludging in short period of times then most likely non barrier pipe has been used. But without inhibitor a plastic system has no chance but sludging. Hence my favorite MLCP as the metal layer is oxygen proof not only a barrier.
Although massive sludging can be caused by leaks as well because of adding constantly oxygen rich water to the system.

As for the copper mentioned in the process of sludging then that is explained by the fact that the different metal ions dissolved in the water do speed up the process of corrosion massively but once the oxygen has been used up then that stops. Meaning if you had a system that does not comprise anything but steel and plastic the process would be slower. But due to the oxygen intrusion still never stops. Just that would require a complete absence of other metals but the sort of steel used for the radiator. It actually could endanger SS heat exchangers as them would start rusting then just as normal steel.

So there is an easy rule: If it is open vented system use inhibitor, if it is a sealed system comprising plastic use inhibitor, if it is a sealed system comprising metal aka copper use inhibitor. The last theoretically does not need it that urgent but how do you make 100% sure that the integrity of the system never ever gets disturbed? As soon as the customer has to top up the system or the boiler comprises plastic fittings or..., well you need it.

But then again we should keep that quite as the volume of system cleans has dramatically reduced over the recent years and I have no other explanation than the use of inhibitor becoming more wide spread. At least for me.

As for the antibacterial feature you can use PVCC pipe as well as it even reduces buildup of lime scales. I had been told that PVCC would be preferred by NHS?

 

[petercj]

Look for the relevant British Standard markings on the pipe:-

John Guest Speedfit - The World Leader in Push-fit Fittings, Pipe and Plastic Plumbing Systems - PEX BARRIER PIPE IN COILS

 

[TBServices]

Good answer dirks!


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[petercj]

Good answer dirks!


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There is a lot of cobblers talked about the use of plastic in central heating systems - plastic has been widely used in the manufacture of vehicle radiators for the past 25 years without major problems - with water at 100c +.

O rings have been used in aero-engineering for decades - next time you take off in a plane spare a thought for the fact that your life depends on those O rings in the system holding up!

A Valliant staff engineer told me that most of the blockages he sees in heat exchangers can be linked to muck being downloaded from header tanks when the system is drained.

A mild steel container such as the average household radiator is going to corrode and produce some kind of debris, however, the process can be slowed down by using inhibitors. Copper and SS are a different matter - both are alloys, and so the quality of each will dictate how well they perform in use. Copper pipe in reasonable nick has been found in Roman ruins. Good quality SS is very resistant to corrosion, and I doubt that corrosion would ever be a problem with a SS heat exchanger unless a problem was caused by a chemical within the water - most metals don't like common-a-garden salt, including aluminium alloys, and poor quality SS can be affected by salt. However, water in a CH system is the same water that goes round and round, and so the content of such water is bound to be fairly stable. Limescale for example, requires fresh water to be constantly introduced and heated to produce a scale. Magnetite (as the name suggests) is magnetic, and so will generally stay in the radiator in which it is produced. The chemicals used to clean CH systems work because they lift magnetite into suspension, making it easier to flush out.

Whereas the problems caused by sludge and scale are unlikely to be all down to myth, the companies who make flushing and cleaning chemicals have a vested interest in exaggerating the problems. If a radiator is so full of sludge that it doesn't heat up as it should, then obviously it needs cleaning out.

For a CH system to become severely sludged, or for a heat exchanger to become blocked by scale, the process is going to require freshly oxygenated water, probably a lot more than can be passed by a plastic pipe, even if it hasn't got a barrier.

How many people on here can honestly say they always check the header tank for muck and debris before draining a system?

Much easier to say that a blocked heat exchanger can be traced to plastic pipe than admit that it's become blocked due to muck being introduced into the system from the header tank, or some other external source.

Whilst copper is usually the best choice, plastic pipe is another - much hated and defiled as it is by many people in the trade.

 

[DirksPlumbing]

There is a lot of cobblers talked about the use of plastic in central heating systems - plastic has been widely used in the manufacture of vehicle radiators for the past 25 years without major problems - with water at 100c +.

Much easier to say that a blocked heat exchanger can be traced to plastic pipe than admit that it's become blocked due to muck being introduced into the system from the header tank, or some other external source.

Whilst copper is usually the best choice, plastic pipe is another - much hated and defiled as it is by many people in the trade.

I am just struggling to explain all the sludged up sealed systems. Or the ones been build from scratch.

And I hope your car mechanic does not fill pure water into your cooling system. Even the use of tap water is to avoid unless there is an emergency and nothing else available.

Just as I hope that you would see the difference between algae etc. and magnetite. A magnet helps on that.

As for the planes, are you gonna go and service the boiler/pipe system at a similar frequency? Do your customers allow that to you?

 

[Tap dancer]

As a so-called "custard" (a term that I feel is derogatory to the people who pay you) I would always specify copper for any work I had done, and would avoid buying any house that was plumbed with plastic.

This goes back to very bad experiences with my 3rd house, which used plastic pipes.

PS They were grey plastic, but don't know what they were called.

 

[petercj]

I am just struggling to explain all the sludged up sealed systems. Or the ones been build from scratch.

And I hope your car mechanic does not fill pure water into your cooling system. Even the use of tap water is to avoid unless there is an emergency and nothing else available.

Just as I hope that you would see the difference between algae etc. and magnetite. A magnet helps on that.

As for the planes, are you gonna go and service the boiler/pipe system at a similar frequency? Do your customers allow that to you?

So how do you explain the conclusion that those sludged up systems are due to the use of plastic pipe?

The pressure inside a vented system is considerably greater than the 14 lbs per square inch on the outside of the pipework, so how does air get sucked in? If there was a vacuum inside the pipe and no barrier, then I could see how it might happen!

Accepting that copper is generally the better choice than plastic, I do believe plastic pipe gets made a scapegoat for all kinds of ills and mistakes made when fitting systems.

Due to an extension before I bought the property, a third of my home is done in plastic, and there have been no problems with it since the mistakes made by the plumber / GSR who fitted it were put right, i.e. using it right up to the boiler, not clipping as required, and muddling up flow and return - he connected the boiler up the wrong way around! It's not just DIY'ers that create problems when using plastic.

If someone on here asked about a leak in copper pipe, the general response would be: "well it sometimes happens", but if it was plastic there would be a queue of people claiming it was evidence that plastic is no good.

I do see the long-term security of the O rings as a potential problem - as I recall, the manufacturer's say they are good for 25 years, but what then? Some kind of sealer that can be left permanently in the system maybe. Sooner or later it's going to be a problem for someone to solve, that's for sure.

Probably only a matter of time before plastic radiators become the norm, so hang on to your headache tablets.

 

[Blumper]

...oh dear, we have bitten the hand that feeds us, a paying custard...!

 

[Doodlebug]

There is a lot of cobblers talked about the use of plastic in central heating systems - plastic has been widely used in the manufacture of vehicle radiators for the past 25 years without major problems - with water at 100c +.

O rings have been used in aero-engineering for decades - next time you take off in a plane spare a thought for the fact that your life depends on those O rings in the system holding up!

A Valliant staff engineer told me that most of the blockages he sees in heat exchangers can be linked to muck being downloaded from header tanks when the system is drained.

A mild steel container such as the average household radiator is going to corrode and produce some kind of debris, however, the process can be slowed down by using inhibitors. Copper and SS are a different matter - both are alloys, and so the quality of each will dictate how well they perform in use. Copper pipe in reasonable nick has been found in Roman ruins. Good quality SS is very resistant to corrosion, and I doubt that corrosion would ever be a problem with a SS heat exchanger unless a problem was caused by a chemical within the water - most metals don't like common-a-garden salt, including aluminium alloys, and poor quality SS can be affected by salt. However, water in a CH system is the same water that goes round and round, and so the content of such water is bound to be fairly stable. Limescale for example, requires fresh water to be constantly introduced and heated to produce a scale. Magnetite (as the name suggests) is magnetic, and so will generally stay in the radiator in which it is produced. The chemicals used to clean CH systems work because they lift magnetite into suspension, making it easier to flush out.

Whereas the problems caused by sludge and scale are unlikely to be all down to myth, the companies who make flushing and cleaning chemicals have a vested interest in exaggerating the problems. If a radiator is so full of sludge that it doesn't heat up as it should, then obviously it needs cleaning out.

For a CH system to become severely sludged, or for a heat exchanger to become blocked by scale, the process is going to require freshly oxygenated water, probably a lot more than can be passed by a plastic pipe, even if it hasn't got a barrier.

How many people on here can honestly say they always check the header tank for muck and debris before draining a system?

Much easier to say that a blocked heat exchanger can be traced to plastic pipe than admit that it's become blocked due to muck being introduced into the system from the header tank, or some other external source.

Whilst copper is usually the best choice, plastic pipe is another - much hated and defiled as it is by many people in the trade.

Can I ask, what do you do? What is the main role of your job? What are you? Are you an engineer? A doctor? What qualifications and experience have you got? How many sludged up blocked systems do you came across? Sorry for all the questions, just curious.


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[petercj]

Can I ask, what do you do? What is the main role of your job? What are you? Are you an engineer? A doctor? What qualifications and experience have you got? How many sludged up blocked systems do you came across? Sorry for all the questions, just curious.


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Attack the argument, not the person dear boy!

 

[Doodlebug]

Attack the argument, not the person dear boy!

Sorry, you've lost me there. Who's attacking who? Not sure where you got that from. I asked you a question.


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[Millsy 82]

I am not a big fan of plastic and the only time I have used it was when I was site bashing I will personally always choose copper. But most of the problems that I have come across with it have been installation faults ( or somebody undoing the fitting thinking their funny) I would have no problems with fitting plastic in my house but I would have to fit it same as with copper as alot of the time its not the material but the muppet fitting it.

As long as its all tested correctly ( the last lot I used was poly plumb and the rep told me to test it to 10 bar so that the grippers would dig into the pipe and hold it and never been called back to any of it that was also their way out of claims if the pipe didnt have the marks they wouldnt pay out) then I cant see a problem.

 

[Gray0689]

Plastic is great all new hoses should be done in it for rads all to manifolds no joints and no fittings

 

[Resolute]

Plastic is great all new hoses should be done in it for rads all to manifolds no joints and no fittings View attachment 7801

You'll be fitting plastic rads next!

 

[Gray0689]

Where in 2012
new houses should have total control the days of upstairs downstairs and hot water only are gone should be every room has separate temp controls

 

[Gray0689]

You'll be fitting plastic rads next!

If they where efficient you bet I would

 

[Doodlebug]

You'll be fitting plastic rads next!

I hope you leave your number with this customer. Lol


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[petercj]

Sorry, you've lost me there. Who's attacking who? Not sure where you got that from. I asked you a question.


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I’m a brain surgeon, and I read the posts on this forum between operations for R&R!

I can tell you why you and your colleagues at British Gas see so much sludge, it’s because whilst charging around £25 a month for looking after your customer’s central heating systems (Home Care) you completely ignore the water in the system, i.e. no checking and no topping up of the inhibitor.

Then when the system is sludged up you tell your customers that for a mere £599.00 BG will power-flush the sludge out, and then thereafter you will actually check the state of the water.

No doubt you tell them that all their plastic pipe-work needs replacing as well!

“Looking after your world” … Best advice = read the small print in the BG Home Care contract very, very, carefully.

:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

 

[Dannypipe]

You're not really a brain surgeon are you....? Surely you would have said neurosurgeon to sound more realistic.

 

[DirksPlumbing]

So how do you explain the conclusion that those sludged up systems are due to the use of plastic pipe?

Not my conclusion. If you use inhibitor and make sure there is enough present plastic does tend not to sludge up excessively either.

The pressure inside a vented system is considerably greater than the 14 lbs per square inch on the outside of the pipework, so how does air get sucked in?

Who talks about air getting sucked in? And forget about a plastic pipe wall it is mere a thick membrane. How do you guess gets hydrogen into expansion vessels even though the pressure is equal both sides? It simply has to do with the fact that nature is based on chaos so if there is a low concentration on one side and a high concentration on the other side it will try to level them out.

If there was a vacuum inside the pipe and no barrier, then I could see how it might happen!

Accepting that copper is generally the better choice than plastic, I do believe plastic pipe gets made a scapegoat for all kinds of ills and mistakes made when fitting systems.

Agreed.

 

[Dannypipe]

How many people on here can honestly say they always check the header tank for muck and debris before draining a system?

Right here. I do, if it's an old system. I will hop into the loft and plug the tank. I have photo's a plently to prove it as I photograph just about everything I do. Cover your bum syndrome.

 

[Subby]

As a so-called "custard" (a term that I feel is derogatory to the people who pay you) I would always specify copper for any work I had done, and would avoid buying any house that was plumbed with plastic.

This goes back to very bad experiences with my 3rd house, which used plastic pipes.

PS They were grey plastic, but don't know what they were called.

That would be pvc-c, the problem with this stuff is that it tends to be very brittle, and splits. I have been to a call out in a very nice big house which had the living room ceiling come down due to the use of this under the floorboards. The whole house was plumbed with it, and it is way too expensive for the owner have someone replace all the pipes, so he has the constant worry of when another leak will spring.
All plastics are not made equal.

 

[Doodlebug]

I’m a brain surgeon, and I read the posts on this forum between operations for R&R!

I can tell you why you and your colleagues at British Gas see so much sludge, it’s because whilst charging around £25 a month for looking after your customer’s central heating systems (Home Care) you completely ignore the water in the system, i.e. no checking and no topping up of the inhibitor.

Then when the system is sludged up you tell your customers that for a mere £599.00 BG will power-flush the sludge out, and then thereafter you will actually check the state of the water.

No doubt you tell them that all their plastic pipe-work needs replacing as well!

“Looking after your world” … Best advice = read the small print in the BG Home Care contract very, very, carefully.

:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

The inhibitor levels in a central heating system are checked on a first visit inspection at the very start of the contract. The customer is then advised on having the inhibitor levels topped up if needed, it's the customers choice whether they want us to do this work or not, we can't force them. The water in the central heating system is not covered under any contract agreement and it is well displayed in the terms of the contract which the customer gets a fresh copy of every 12 months. The exclusions of the contract are no longer in small print but are laid out in a way that the customer actually can't miss them, but how many customers read the terms and conditions of their contract, yes you guessed it, not many. The inhibitor levels are not checked every year on an annual service visit as this is not part of a service. Their is certain things that are out of control of British Gas, ie: customers or decorators removing radiators or installing fancy modern radiators and not topping up the inhibitor levels. The customers who do top up there inhibitor don't know what they are doing and just put it in the header tank where it stays. What is it you expect British Gas to do? It's clearly written in the terms and conditions of the contract what customers are getting for their money before they take out the contract.
I look forward to your reply Petercj.

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[Dannypipe]

Doodle, someone else made the presumption that you were a BG employee, and you quickly defended yourself by stating you were infact anti BG.

I think this happened as far as my memory serves me correct. Can you confirm? Just interested.

 

[Doodlebug]

Doodle, someone else made the presumption that you were a BG employee, and you quickly defended yourself by stating you were infact anti BG.

I think this happened as far as my memory serves me correct. Can you confirm? Just interested.

When did I state I was anti BG? Lol I may have stated that I don't agree with everything that British Gas do, but I deal with facts and I don't like it when people make assumptions. British Gas make mistakes but the important thing is that when they make mistakes they put it right. Did you know that British Gas is now regulated by the FSA so it's in the companies interest to deal with any complaints at ground level.


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[DirksPlumbing]

That would be pvc-c, the problem with this stuff is that it tends to be very brittle, and splits.

If it is gray and brittle it is PVC-U(S). PVC-C tends to be beige and does not contain softener. Therefore it remains flexible for a lot longer. Fitted quite a bit of it long time ago (Friatec). No hassle up to day. PVC-U as well lacks the antibac properties.

 

[Dannypipe]

When did I state I was anti BG? Lol I may have stated that I don't agree with everything that British Gas do, but I deal with facts and I don't like it when people make assumptions. British Gas make mistakes but the important thing is that when they make mistakes they put it right. Did you know that British Gas is now regulated by the FSA so it's in the companies interest to deal with any complaints at ground level.


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I'm not picking on you, but you said and I quote:

'I'm not the British Gas Howard pmsl
In fact I am critical of British Gas myself.'

 

[Doodlebug]

I'm not picking on you, but you said and I quote:

'I'm not the British Gas Howard pmsl
In fact I am critical of British Gas myself.'

Yes that's correct, I am critical of some things they do. Not everyone is perfect.


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[Dannypipe]

For the record, I'm not anti BG at all, infact I have a masive respect for them. It's like if you are religious, you respect the bible/koran or whatever literature suits your religion.

BG have been around a long time, and have a massive wealth of experience.....but they do rip people off. So it's not all the 'good word' LOL.

 

[petercj]

The inhibitor levels in a central heating system are checked on a first visit inspection at the very start of the contract. The customer is then advised on having the inhibitor levels topped up if needed, it's the customers choice whether they want us to do this work or not, we can't force them. The water in the central heating system is not covered under any contract agreement and it is well displayed in the terms of the contract which the customer gets a fresh copy of every 12 months. The exclusions of the contract are no longer in small print but are laid out in a way that the customer actually can't miss them, but how many customers read the terms and conditions of their contract, yes you guessed it, not many. The inhibitor levels are not checked every year on an annual service visit as this is not part of a service. Their is certain things that are out of control of British Gas, ie: customers or decorators removing radiators or installing fancy modern radiators and not topping up the inhibitor levels. The customers who do top up there inhibitor don't know what they are doing and just put it in the header tank where it stays. What is it you expect British Gas to do? It's clearly written in the terms and conditions of the contract what customers are getting for their money before they take out the contract.
I look forward to your reply Petercj.

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The truth of the matter is that all BG provide for the £25 a month they take from their customers who have Home Care is an annual safety check.

The BG adverts are full of reassurance for the customer, i.e. "Looking After Your World" ... "peace of mind, etc, etc" ... promises, promises, which are rescinded by the small print in the contract.

As for dealing with complaints, BG have been fined millions by Ofgem for their poor handling of complaints.

 

[Dannypipe]

I'm just trying to suss you out Doodle. It's my nature to do so!

 

[Doodlebug]

For the record, I'm not anti BG at all, infact I have a masive respect for them. It's like if you are religious, you respect the bible/koran or whatever literature suits your religion.

BG have been around a long time, and have a massive wealth of experience.....but they do rip people off. So it's not all the 'good word' LOL.

If I offer you a product for say £600 and you know you can get product for say £400 but you still decide to take the £600 product, who's ripping who off?


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[Dannypipe]

If I offer you a product for say £600 and you know you can get product for say £400 but you still decide to take the £600 product, who's ripping who off?


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Great answer, and one which I really don't have a smart alec response to.

 

[Dannypipe]

The truth of the matter is that all BG provide for the £25 a month they take from their customers who have Home Care is an annual safety check.

The BG adverts are full of reassurance for the customer, i.e. "Looking After Your World" ... "peace of mind, etc, etc" ... promises, promises, which are rescinded by the small print in the contract.

As for dealing with complaints, BG have been fined millions by Ofgem for their poor handling of complaints.

Do you think the same will be made of other large companies (the AA for example)?

I find it un-nerving the way big business is squeezing out the small firm.

I try to offer the best possible service I can. 24 hour call out, and I personally will bend over backwards for a customer, as I know it helps MY business grow. Big business can offer the same but do the engineers/plumbers really care, or do they just want to get their shift done and go home?

 

[Doodlebug]

The truth of the matter is that all BG provide for the £25 a month they take from their customers who have Home Care is an annual safety check.

The BG adverts are full of reassurance for the customer, i.e. "Looking After Your World" ... "peace of mind, etc, etc" ... promises, promises, which are rescinded by the small print in the contract.

As for dealing with complaints, BG have been fined millions by Ofgem for their poor handling of complaints.

The small print? Where? What small print? Do you really want me to take a photo of the terms and post on here? The exclusions of the contract are printed very clearly and even highlighted. You say £25 a month, who exactly are you referring to? Every customer pays a different price depending on what's system or boiler they have, ie: a customer with an unvented cylinder will obviously pay more than a customer with a standard indirect cylinder. It's like insuring you car, I've got a porsche and you've got a robin reliant, who's insurance do you think will be the most? British Gas fined millions for poor handling of complaint, I don't doubt it, like I have said before, British Gas aren't perfect but are doing there very best to be as close to perfect as is possible. Complaints is something that the company are trying to reduce and I know this as its down at customer facing level that matters.
You don't seem to be reading my posts Petercj, I'm now losing the will to live pmsl


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[Dannypipe]

But all the time you Doodle seem like a metaphorical stick of BG rock.

Crack you in half and it says 'Doodle, British Gas!' - In the middle

 

[Dannypipe]

and I should add, there are a lot more people shouting BG down than supporting them.

 

[Doodlebug]

Do you think the same will be made of other large companies (the AA for example)?

I find it un-nerving the way big business is squeezing out the small firm.

I try to offer the best possible service I can. 24 hour call out, and I personally will bend over backwards for a customer, as I know it helps MY business grow. Big business can offer the same but do the engineers/plumbers really care, or do they just want to get their shift done and go home?

My mate works for himself and I know how hard he works and it's a lot harder than me. He is a very very good engineer and is never short of work because of how good he is. It's a shame that there is a lot of cowboys out there and it's the cowboys that push people to coming to British Gas. You will always have work if your good, as most of your work will eventually come from word of mouth. If a customer is dissatisfied they tell say 10 people but a customer who is satisfied will only tell 5 people, shame but true.


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[Doodlebug]

But all the time you Doodle seem like a metaphorical stick of BG rock.

Crack you in half and it says 'Doodle, British Gas!' - In the middle

Pmsl they pay my wages. To be honest mate it wouldn't matter if it was British Gas or any other company, I will always say what I see. I don't doubt there are a small minority of people who will let the company down. British Gas will always get a lot of stick its the nature of the British people. In America they praise a person or establishment that is successful, in this country it seems people like to criticise anyone who is doing well. British Gas employ a lot of people, isn't that a good thing for the economy?


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[Dannypipe]

I hope so. I am constantly busy. Working late to get the back log done, but I worry because if the phone stops ringing, I can't pay my bills. It's often a pain that the phone rings just when I don't want it to, but it's what puts bread on the table.

I have been offered a job interview with BG a few times, and always declined as my business is my third child and I love it.

Yesterday I worked in so many random places, and ended up in the evening working in a farmers field, in the night (with head torch) fixing a cattle water trough, (I grew up in a village called Cowden - lots of farmers!!).

I just thought, I love this, working for myself, employing a couple of good friends, and meeting new people all the time. I'd hate to become part of the machine. Just clocking in and out. It's not the same. I as take pride in because it's MY business.

I have met some brilliant BG engineers though. The old boys, who's knowledge is just amazing.

 

[Doodlebug]

I hope so. I am constantly busy. Working late to get the back log done, but I worry because if the phone stops ringing, I can't pay my bills. It's often a pain that the phone rings just when I don't want it to, but it's what puts bread on the table.

I have been offered a job interview with BG a few times, and always declined as my business is my third child and I love it.

Yesterday I worked in so many random places, and ended up in the evening working in a farmers field, in the night (with head torch) fixing a cattle water trough, (I grew up in a village called Cowden - lots of farmers!!).

I just thought, I love this, working for myself, employing a couple of good friends, and meeting new people all the time. I'd hate to become part of the machine. Just clocking in and out. It's not the same. I as take pride in because it's MY business.

I have met some brilliant BG engineers though. The old boys, who's knowledge is just amazing.

I admire you mate, you do what I'd love to do but I took the easy option. I like the fact I can switch my phone off at the end of my shift.


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[petercj]

Rumour has it that Doodlebug is a cyborg, and that he was created in a secret BG laboratory located in the Welsh valleys - people say he can stick his finger in a flu and get a totally accurate gas reading flash in front of his eyes!

He can only respond positively to criticism of BG because his reactions have been programmed into his cpu at BG HQ!

He never sleeps, they just stand him in a corner and charge his batteries every 12 hours.

BG plan to release 20 new Doodlebugs over the next 12 months.

;-)

 

[Doodlebug]

Rumour has it that Doodlebug is a cyborg, and that he was created in a secret BG laboratory located in the Welsh valleys - people say he can stick his finger in a flu and get a totally accurate gas reading flash in front of his eyes!

He can only respond positively to criticism of BG because his reactions have been programmed into his cpu at BG HQ!

He never sleeps, they just stand him in a corner and charge his batteries every 12 hours.

BG plan to release 20 new Doodlebugs over the next 12 months.

;-)

Pmsl I once got My finger stuck in the flue of an open flued boiler. I noticed the flue at the back of the boiler looked corroded, so I squeezed down the side of the boiler and poked the corroded area with my finger. My finger went straight through the flue and I couldn't remove it without it cutting into me. Luckily I could just about reach my phone and call a colleague. Ten minutes I was stuck there waiting, that was a long ten minutes, I was thinking all sorts, I imagined the fire brigade turning up and all sorts, I was thinking oh no, I'm gone be in the local papers for this. I was so relieved to see my mate turn up and even more relieved when he managed to dismantle the flue and release me. I nearly did a Croppie and kissed him pmsl


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[Dannypipe]

Well I'm not going to pick on Doodle just because he's BG employed. He can clearly take a joke, and also knows a lot about the business, so it’s an attribute to the forum that he's willing to come on and spend his valuable time advising others.

Now we just need to persuade him to set up his own business, and we'll all be happy!! LOL

 

[petercj]

Well I'm not going to pick on Doodle just because he's BG employed. He can clearly take a joke, and also knows a lot about the business, so it’s an attribute to the forum that he's willing to come on and spend his valuable time advising others.

Now we just need to persuade him to set up his own business, and we'll all be happy!! LOL

I don't pick on anyone - my criticisms are of BG. If Doodlebug chooses to defend BG that's up to him. It's not a personal issue, which I think Doodlebug does appreciate. The cyborg thing is just a bit of banter.