Licensing of plumbers

[OffshoreGas]

Ok it's British Standard BS 7671:2018 Requirements for Electrical Installations

While it is not statutory it can be quoted in a court of law and deals with most installation, testing, and maintenance of electrical circuits

Most of which is massively berond the scope of domestic plumbing and heating systems.

 

[Ziggie]

In US there seems to be a jumbled mess of state laws regarding construction. One common one however seems to be plumbing work must be completed by a licensed contractor. This appears to be similar to GasSafe but cover all aspects of plumbing and heating. Do people think the U.K. would benefit from a similar scheme?

I’ll start with my pragmatic if somewhat cyclical view.

I’m not aware of any justification in terms of health or safety to extend the scope of a scheme like gas safe to cover all aspects of plumbing and heating not just gas.

Also I think GasSafe and Part P were largely motivated by ensuring HMRC received their pound of flesh for reasonably expensive but otherwise difficult to trace domestic work and consumer safety was a side benefit.

I think there always have been and always will be a range of clients in the domestic construction market. Some are a little more comfortable and happily pay for a decent standard of work. Some will choose to undertake work themselves and others will choose a person not competent to compete the task.

I’d be surprised if the percentage of those in these groups have changed dramatically over the last 60 years.

In US there seems to be a jumbled mess of state laws regarding construction. One common one however seems to be plumbing work must be completed by a licensed contractor. This appears to be similar to GasSafe but cover all aspects of plumbing and heating. Do people think the U.K. would benefit from a similar scheme?

I’ll start with my pragmatic if somewhat cyclical view.

I’m not aware of any justification in terms of health or safety to extend the scope of a scheme like gas safe to cover all aspects of plumbing and heating not just gas.

Also I think GasSafe and Part P were largely motivated by ensuring HMRC received their pound of flesh for reasonably expensive but otherwise difficult to trace domestic work and consumer safety was a side benefit.

I think there always have been and always will be a range of clients in the domestic construction market. Some are a little more comfortable and happily pay for a decent standard of work. Some will choose to undertake work themselves and others will choose a person not competent to compete the task.

I’d be surprised if the percentage of those in these groups have changed dramatically over the last 60 years.

Around 1.1 million gas jobs are carried out every year by illegal fitters who aren’t properly qualified, putting householders at risk of carbon monoxide poisoning, gas leaks, fires and explosions, a government body has warned.

These guys might need help in realising that you need better information and access to specialised tools to do the job.

The most common cause of electrical fires is the inappropriate use of ovens as heaters. Perhaps we need to get registered before we cook in the kitchen
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BS7671 is the requirements for electrical installation normally referred to as the wiring regulations.
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Fair comment on electrical work on heating systems it’s generally shockingly bad to the point of criminal.

Not sure the 18th edition course is right for plumbers, I sat it a few months back and 95% of it is irrelevant to plumbing/heating.

But the other 5%?
Example: do you realise that if you install a new circuit from the distribution board , you need to inform the local authority?

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Around 1.1 million gas jobs are carried out every year by illegal fitters who aren’t properly qualified, putting householders at risk of carbon monoxide poisoning, gas leaks, fires and explosions, a government body has warned.

These guys might need help in realising that you need better information and access to specialised tools to do the job.

The most common cause of electrical fires is the inappropriate use of ovens as heaters. Perhaps we need to get registered before we cook in the kitchen
[automerge]1569145288[/automerge]

But the other 5%?
Example: do you realise that if you install a new circuit from the distribution board , you need to inform the local authority?

Yes and also any electrical work in a bathroom / special area

 

[OffshoreGas]

Around 1.1 million gas jobs are carried out every year by illegal fitters who aren’t properly qualified, putting householders at risk of carbon monoxide poisoning, gas leaks, fires and explosions, a government body has warned.

These guys might need help in realising that you need better information and access to specialised tools to do the job.

The most common cause of electrical fires is the inappropriate use of ovens as heaters. Perhaps we need to get registered before we cook in the kitchen
[automerge]1569145288[/automerge]

But the other 5%?
Example: do you realise that if you install a new circuit from the distribution board , you need to inform the local authority?

Yeah, I know a little about electrical work.

I’d say installing a new circuit is massively outside most plumbers competence/insurance and doubt any carry the required tools for testing.

 

[Ziggie]

Can anyone confirm that the colleges are not going to pass on knowledge to the apprentices as they are not GS and they might use the knowledge before or instead of qualifying

 

[Deleted member 32524]

All trades should have a register and licence approach. Cut down on cowboys and I believe people would have a better understanding of an apples for apples price for works as everyone, I think, would be in more or less the same ball park using the correct trades for the scope. Everyone would know that bob was not a tiler, spark and plumber unless they could produce their trading licence to prove they were competent. Maybe even make it mandatory to have all relevant trade ID numbers on paperwork and van.

 

[centralheatking]

The gas regulation set up in the Uk is a case in point.
When I started anybody could do it, then we had Corgi
then Acops then Acts and now GsR. But still customers
will hire unqualified people for various reasons...financial
or ignorance. If the domestic gas industry cannot yet be closed down then the prospects of regulating Plumbing or any MES are remote.

However ...if the merchants were required to see accreditation before selling gear then maybe...but it will not happen TOO much money to be made...all we can do is as Dan has put up is to engage with all whom approach UKPF on any level help assist and if their plan is lala
let them know and offer to adjust it
centralheatking

 

[Welder]

I’m not aware of any justification in terms of health or safety to extend the scope of a scheme like gas safe to cover all aspects of plumbing and heating not just gas.

Believe me there are instance every single day of regs infringements that genuinely endanger lives... Speak to Paul Daley (among others) on Twitter and be prepared to be truly shocked.

I believe that ANYONE working on water supplies should be Water Regs licensed with random drop in assessments of ALL work. Yes, that may sound daft and OTT, but IMHO it's simply too important not to be especially as water as resource becomes more precious.

 

[OffshoreGas]

Believe me there are instance every single day of regs infringements that genuinely endanger lives... Speak to Paul Daley (among others) on Twitter and be prepared to be truly shocked.

I believe that ANYONE working on water supplies should be Water Regs licensed with random drop in assessments of ALL work. Yes, that may sound daft and OTT, but IMHO it's simply too important not to be especially as water as resource becomes more precious.

Paul Daley’s twitter feed is dedicated to back flow/contamination. I’ve had to scroll back nearly 3 months to find any mention of anyone becoming ill. Results on google are fairly sparse. Lots of rhetoric but it doesn’t seem like the next global pandemic that’s going to wipe us all out.

 

[rpm]

All trades should have a register and licence approach. Cut down on cowboys and I believe people would have a better understanding of an apples for apples price for works as everyone, I think, would be in more or less the same ball park using the correct trades for the scope. Everyone would know that bob was not a tiler, spark and plumber unless they could produce their trading licence to prove they were competent. Maybe even make it mandatory to have all relevant trade ID numbers on paperwork and van.

I`m gonna disagree about everyone would be more or less in the same ballpark price wise, don`t think it will happen as there will always be somebody willing to do it cheaper, ie newbies starting out and wanting the work.