Compression joint leak hassle.

[axzed]

Hi,
It's a lead pipe with a compression joint to receive the stopcock. It could be an olive or a fixed union 'ferrule.' I can't stop it leaking from behind the 'nut'. If it is a union, where is the critical seal that I need to 'make' and how can I accomplish this as I have already pushed in PTF and Boss?
I do not wish to dismantle it again just to take a photo, knowing it will still leak as I am tired of repeatedly doing this and I am using the street stopcock which is leaking and may soon become unservicable!
cheers

 

[WHPES]

If the street stopcock starts leaking it is the responsibility of the water board to maintain it.

I would get a pro to come in and sort out your lead pipe union if you are having difficulty.

 

[axzed]

It's only a small leak in the street but it fills the well. They have been told that it has broken months ago! I have jammed a socket on it and use a long wrench bar.
I am only asking for your empirical knowledge here to save time and effort- I am quite capable of applying it.
thanks

 

[axzed]

That photo really helped - thanks guys.
I will bite the bullet and find my own solution.
nice.
THANKS

 

[WHPES]

Just keep phoning them up until they get sick and come and fix the street stopcock.

I thought you were meaning that the incoming pipe was made of lead but from the picture I see that you were meaning that it is copper with lead soldered joints.

You need to get a new stopcock, undo the old one, remove the olives and nuts and fit the new stopcock with a couple of turns of ptfe round the olives.

 

[axzed]

That is the overhauled replacement stopcock and after many attempts, using PTFE & Boss, I cannot stop the leak from below the lower nut.
That's what my whole query is about.
Is it a union, not olives and if so, where do I pack it, as I have tried behind the union/olive?
I can't back off the nut enough to see it.
Are more turns of PTFE counter productive?

 

[franz]

if you cant get to it with two hands thats tricky at best. best bet it to open the floor a bit ,or your just killing yourself struggling.

 

[WHPES]

Open it up and expose some fresh pipework. It looks like it is stepped down from 22mm so get down below this step and fit a new compression coupling then a new section of copper.

Be careful not to damage the pipe when chiselling.

 

[NickH]

Is it just me or does that stopcock look like its on backwards ?

If you've changed it presumably you can get it out of the way and have a look at the olive. You can get an olive puller which should be able to pull it off with the nut.
The incomimg pipework is copper so I would try to solder a new piece of 15mm onto the old piece and get a new stopcock higher up (out of the hole).

Bail the water out of the hole and use a length of thin plastic tubing to suck the water out of the pipework, clean the pipes carefully and use a yorkshire (solder ring) fitting to make the joint.

Can you solder ?

 

[fuzzy]

Thanks.
So you are saying that the seal is the olive/tap joint & not the nut/olive?
Can it be, & what if it is a flange?
Regardless of the working space I can't see how I can prise the olive off as the nut will not back off enough.
How delicate is the lead to copper joint?
cheers.

dont ptfe the thread(if this is what you are doing). My dad did this on a compression joint once, he did it 3 or 4 times then called me. i took off 3 rolls of ptfe from the thread, put a small amount round the olive and tightened up just a bit and hey presto never a problem since!


people see the thread on a compression and presume that is the joint, that only pushes the olive against the pipe and fitting,t he easier it is to tighten the better fixing you will get

that is the overhauled replacement stopcock and after many attempts, using ptfe & boss, i cannot stop the leak from below the lower nut.
That's what my whole query is about.
Is it a union, not olives and if so, where do i pack it, as i have tried behind the union/olive?
I can't back off the nut enough to see it.
Are more turns of ptfe counter productive?

no ptfe on the thread if olive or union

 

[pete m l]

sounds like if you have old lead mains then its time to run a new plastic main complete from the road and do a proper job rather than keep trying to bodge it up

 

[fuzzy]

sounds like if you have old lead mains then its time to run a new plastic main complete from the road and do a proper job rather than keep trying to bodge it up

stop spoiling our fun!

 

[pete m l]

oh I forgot this was a fun site try putting a hose pipe and jubilee clip on that will stop the leak

 

[axzed]

Thanks all.
I could just move house too.
"my whole query is about.
Is it a union, not an olive and if so, where do i pack it, as i have tried behind the union/olive?
I can't back off the nut enough to see what it is."
Early on in this posting I was told that as it is a stopcock, it can't be an olive, but a union & maybe a leather washer!
Well, I guess I can deduce from all your references to olives that this aint necessarily true.
I initially connected with minimal PTF but later noticed lots of it already behind the olive/union that I tweezered out & later back in.

 

[moony]

mate youve tried most things a diyer would, as a professional (i think) haha, i would dig out the hole, explore the pipe work a bit deeper down, if lead then use a lead lock on a fresh piece of lead, run 15mm up out of hole and fit a new stop tap. You can mess around with the olive, union or pipework all you want and may find you seal it, but this is the incoming mains and ive seen too much damage to property from poorly fitted stop tap or lead lock to warrent you risking this.

its a simple job for a professional, prob cost no more than 60-80 quid and it would come with piece of mind and a more suitably located stop tap. I dont know how much time you,ve spent but i would certainly think of getting hold of someone who can come and have a proper look at it.

if its a olive and youve packed it out with ptfe and its still leaking, then there could be a fault with the fitting requiring a new one to be fitted - the lads have tried to help on here but its not as easy as saying do this do that and bobs your uncle. hence the 4 year training required.