Installing acrylic shower bath.

[Hump1]

I am in the process of replacing our bath with a acrylic shower bath but concerned about the perceived poor support the 'cradle' will give. In my youth as a apprentice plumber I used to install baths, at that time in the 60's baths were solid cast iron with cast iron waste pipes, hot lead run joints etc so everything was solid. I left the trade long before plastic baths came along. It dosn't fill me with confidence when I look at 2 pieces of tubular steel expected to support the weight of 200 litres of water+ a human being. I would also like to connect the 22mm pipes directly to the bath taps rather than use any flexible hose as I have learned that the latter has only a 10year life as opposed to copper which has a 30-50 year life. I would be very grateful if anybody could give me some tips on reinforcing the support the bath will need and any info on problems that may arise by connecting the copper pipes to this type of bath directly. Many thanks.

 

[Hardy1]

batton the back out and use 2x4 at the front where the bath panel would be, and if you want , L-brackets to support it to the walls(as many as you want)

 

[Deleted member 25704]

Measure height of bath (panel) and install a level batton round periphery. Apply sanitary silicone to batton, and drop bath onto it. Let the nuts on the feet go loose, and allow feet to drop to floor. Screw feet down. Now tighten nuts on feet, being careful to pull the bath down onto batton. Check levels.

If you have a high pressure system, then use 15mm and pipe in plastics (25 year guarantee) - this will save you hours of work. Use speed-fit tap connectors and just slip pipe into fitting.

For combined waste and overflow, throw away one supplied with bath (usually banjo type) and buy a 'bette' pop up bath combined waste kit - bristan do one as well, but make sure its the white one (not black) with double seal o ring on overflow.

 

[Hump1]

Thanks for info Hardy1, will feel happier with extra support with battons+L brackets. I had a friend who's wife ended up like a beached whale on the bathroom floor as the bath toppled over. Badly installed cradle apparently!

 

[Hump1]

Thanks Clanger for info. Your level round batten periphery solution certainly sounds far more robust than the manufacturers flimsy cradle. On the supply pipe issue the cold supply is high pressure mains but the hot is low pressure from open vent system (about 3 metres head). Are plastics ok on elavated tempratures? I am from the old school and always used copper but I suppose the metal is a finite resource and one day there will be no choice but use plastics!

 

[PlumbBobBob]

plastic pipes will be fine to pipe up in

 

[Hump1]

Many thanks for info Steveb, its just that I am from old 'copper school' and wary of changing to plastics but I will just have to get used to it. One day copper will just be too scarce and expensive to use for piping anyway!

 

[kay-jay]

plastic is perfectly fine but if you personally prefer copper and the installation is in your own home then use copper by all means.

 

[Deleted member 25704]

Thanks Clanger for info. Your level round batten periphery solution certainly sounds far more robust than the manufacturers flimsy cradle. On the supply pipe issue the cold supply is high pressure mains but the hot is low pressure from open vent system (about 3 metres head). Are plastics ok on elavated tempratures? I am from the old school and always used copper but I suppose the metal is a finite resource and one day there will be no choice but use plastics!

I don't think there is a better material than copper for plumbing - but plastics are more simple for domestic plumbing installations in my opinion and they offer user benefits of noise reduction.

As for elevated temperatures, you make a good point and this was one of my earlier concerns with plastics. However, elevated temperatures are indeed elevated due to pressure (raise pressure, you raise the boiling point of water). If your cylinder is only under 3m head, then there is little risk of meltdown, unless you have a solid fuel boiler and under sized heat leak/cylinder.

Piping baths with 22mm copper tails is a hassle, which is made easy by plastics.

 

[Hump1]

Thanks Clanger, I think I will give the plastics a go. A good point you raised is the noise that the copper creates especially the cold supply which is straight off mains. Hopefully the plastics will reduce this.

 

[Hump1]

Thanks kay-jay. I think I will give the plastics a go as the copper does create a bit of a racket especially the cold supply.

 

[Hardy1]

no probz. ino what it feels like when you wouldnt do or leave sumfing till ur 100000% sure its fine, (to all the cowboys out there who dont care and jus like ripping people off and putting other businesses out of business by doing jobs cheaper and crapper go :33

 

[gravytrain]

also speedfit do these tap connectors called hand tight. i didnt believe it at first but they do work
you just do em up hand tight and push fit your pipe in. plastic or copper.
if i'm not using flexis i use these.

http://www.*************/p/jg-speedfit-tap-connector-22mm-x-pack-of-2/85981


don't forget your isolation valves to be up to date with water regs !

 

[Hump1]

Fitted up bath with battens allround, dropped onto silicone bed, bath as solid as rock. Fitted 22mm plastic supply pipes, no problem with cold supply, nice and quiet compared to copper but flow rate from hot very poor. Hot supply is from open vent system, low pressure, 22mm piping, about 3 meters head. Took plastic hose out and tried plastic direct to hot tap, slight improvement but still poor. Eventually reverted back to 22mm copper right up to tap on hot supply, big improvement. Also removed service valve and replaced it with Pegler lever full bore ball valve, even bigger improvement! It seems any restrictions on pipe bore in a low pressure system like this (0.2/0.3 bar) makes a huge difference to flow rate. Even the inserts inside plastic fittings seem to restrict flow at this pressure! Having said that I can see why people go for plastic when you see the price of copper and some brass fittings! Between £12 to £17 for 2 metre by 22mm copper!. Straight compression 22mm to 3/4 tap conn. £9+
Has anybody else come across this problem on low pressure sys's?

 

[Best]

Don't know where you are buying the copper pipe & fittings, but you are getting ripped off! Copper pipe is not anywhere near that price & the compression tap fittings are way too much, - soldered type are pennies! A vented system should be fine if copper pipes are large sizes - even consider 28mm feed to & from cylinder & cold also, if a lot supplies. It is often the modern taps & mixers that are poor flow on vented low pressure work.

 

[PlumbBobBob]

i agree you're paying through the nose for your copper and fittings. modern taps aren't as good for flow, you need to check that they are for low pressure i.e. 0.1 bar upwards.

 

[Guest123]

One minor advantage to plastic pipe is that it heats up quicker in a hot water system than copper and retains its heat for longer. I never use anything but full bore isolating valves as the cheap ones leak through time from the screw slot and they restrict flow.

 

[Hump1]

Thanks for reply Best. Could have got copper cheaper if I had bought 10 pack 3m by 22mm but only needed 2 lenghs of 2 metres. Screwfix out of stock in soldered tap conns. Had to buy yorkshire kuterlight as only in stock 22mm by 3/4 stock no 50256. £9.99 each! Could have waited a day but needed to get job finished. Taps are Bristan Oval bath pair 3/4 minimum pressure 0.1 bar on Bristan website. Flow is now ok since changing 22mm copper straight to tap (no hose) and full bore peglar service valve.

 

[Hump1]

Thanks for reply Steveb, Taps are Bristan oval ( got them on Screwfix sale 33% off) 3/4 bath, minimum pressure 0.1 on their technical data. Flow rate now ok since I changed to 22mm straight to tap (no hose) and peglar full bore service valve.

 

[Hump1]

Thanks for reply system3. You are right that plastic has better thermal properties, copper does lose a lot of heat. I have started insulating all the copper now as losing heat costs a lot of money nowadays!