Ecoflam minor 1 black smoke

[Gam plumb]

Hi, I have had two recent minor 1 burners with the same problem, thick black soot with ppm off the scale, checking & adjusting oil pressure & air makes no difference, first occasion I tried new nozzle, motor, pump checked flue etc, I rigged up a temp oil supply, both were on thermocon boilers one with balanced flue & second on a conventional flue. After speaking to many other engineers each with there own diagnosis, I have not got to the route cause, any help gratefully received

 

[Roger Welton]

Burning too rich, insufficient air or too much fuel. Anything more than that would be guesswork without seeing the appliances.

 

[Ermintrude]

Were the flues clear? Houses hadn't been cavity walled had they? Went to a thorn floor stander black as ace of spades, intake 50% cavity wall ! (Air bricks into compartment )

 

[Gam plumb]

Thanks Roger.
im new to this site but this one is bugging me, I checked the air adjuster on both & went down a nozzle size to try to get them to run clean, with no joy on both burners, two burners with the same problem in a week ! I hoped that someone had come across the same problem

 

[Best]

Firstly I would say, on the older Minor 1s, there is an air flap inside the air cover & it seizes sometimes closed or near closed.
Also, Minor 1s often have problem of leaks at where the nozzle tightens into. (a thread of ptfe seals it).
The more recent burners had an adjustable diffuser, which I found to be all set wrong & MIs wrong & needed set using CO2 readings until correct.

 

[Gam plumb]

The balanced flue was straight out the side, I thought the seals on the flue had failed so It was burning its own gases, I pulled off the breather with no difference

 

[Gam plumb]

Both were older ones with the flaps removed, no oil inside & I have had that before Best, but thanks for trying

 

[Best]

Both were older ones with the flaps removed, no oil inside & I have had that before Best, but thanks for trying

Nozzle leak is hard to test, so make sure you rule it out.
Is the burner the type with adjustable diffuser?

 

[Gam plumb]

Thanks best I will , but I,m pretty sure they are not leaking, neither have the adjustable diffuser

 

[Best]

Thanks best I will , but I,m pretty sure they are not leaking, neither have the adjustable diffuser

Not a lot left to go wrong then, - as long as the air adjustment if actually opening/closing the air up or down? Bit suspicious if the burner is going equally bad no matter what adjustment you make.

 

[Best]

Just wondering if you could bench test any of the boilers to test the flame?

 

[Gam plumb]

Not a lot left to go wrong then, - as long as the air adjustment if actually opening/closing the air up or down? Bit suspicious if the burner is going equally bad no matter what adjustment you make.

Tell me about it ! It is opening & closing as intended, no matter what you do the ppm is throwing the analyser to cut out after a split second in the test point 4000+

 

[lame plumber]

smoke tester before you bung in your expensive analyser is best method

 

[Best]

smoke tester before you bung in your expensive analyser is best method

My thoughts exactly, only you got there before me!
Smoke pump will do the job & quick. If it's black there's no point in using anything else to test.

 

[Gam plumb]

My thoughts exactly, only you got there before me!
Smoke pump will do the job & quick. If it's black there's no point in using anything else to test.

Point taken gents but that gives you an idea of how bad they are

 

[lame plumber]

it means you can get a 0 or 1 and wont kill your analyser as you will do with your method

 

[kimbo]

I have been to a few like this including my own. The common thing with them all was flue gas leakage either from the flue which on the early ones were cut to length and taped which was a recipe for disaster. Did you run them up with the door off and the snorkel off. The burner gasket goes hard on those and splits. If everything else appears ok I would be looking at the fan or motor. The fan could be slipping and not delvering enough air or possibly the motor running a bit slow.
I take it is burning clean oil and not contaminated stuff

 

[WHPES]

I would have said flue seals, even with the snorkel off it can draw air down there. Stuff up the outlet, put some smoke pellets in the combustion chamber and put the burner back with the solenoid coil unplugged and run and see if you get smoke leakage around the flue joints.

 

[Gam plumb]

Thanks for all your advice guys, i have with the exception of the fan slipping tried all of the above, new burner gasket, countless nozzles, snorkel off, tea towel in the balanced flue, back door open, new motor, pump, fresh temp oil supply from a 25L drum, checked the air damper for operation opening/closing on the slider, bit the bullet today & put a new max 1 on it, fired up good as gold after a dam good clean up, i will get to the bottom of the problem with this burner even if it means sending it to Ecoflam

 

[Bunker]

You checked your analyser filter?

 

[WHPES]

Had a Firebird condensing combi this week. Could not get the CO below 75ppm whatever I tried, with the snorkel off, flame spreader position altered or anything. Very puzzling.