Advice on work done by gas safe engineer

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newgal85

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Hi Guys - sorry but this is going to be a long post!

Recently had some work done in my house to move a boiler, clean cold water tank and pressurize central heating system - this was done by a gas safe registered engineer. Another plumber has come over to do other work in the house and he has mentioned that the work done is not correct - apparently the magna cleaner should be attached to the return pipe but its attached to the flow pipe and the cold water tank has not been been cleaned out - have pictures to confirm this- just wanted a second opinion before I went back to the engineer or request an inspection by Gas Safe - should the magna cleaner be attached to the return pipe as he advised? If so should I call the original plumber back (he's not cooperating much as he is not happy I gave my other jobs to another plumber) or should I let him know Im going to complain to Gas Safe? P.S he hasnt given certificate yet either but I guess legally he has 30 days to do this so I can't do anything about this until the time is up - as it was a cash job he said he can't give me reciept either although previously he confirmed in text that he could give me a receipt - any advice on how to deal with this situation?
 
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Magna Clean should be on the return before the boiler, to collect debris etc. Not on its way out of the boiler.
 
Last edited:
As my fellow GSI 's have stated this is not a gas safe issue , the Magna clean would be better fitted on the return but as as a last resort can be fitted on the flow . Kop
 
newgal85 said:
Hi Guys - sorry but this is going to be a long post!

Recently had some work done in my house to move a boiler, clean cold water tank and pressurize central heating system - this was done by a gas safe registered engineer. Another plumber has come over to do other work in the house and he has mentioned that the work done is not correct - apparently the magna cleaner should be attached to the return pipe but its attached to the flow pipe and the cold water tank has not been been cleaned out - have pictures to confirm this- just wanted a second opinion before I went back to the engineer or request an inspection by Gas Safe - should the magna cleaner be attached to the return pipe as he advised? If so should I call the original plumber back (he's not cooperating much as he is not happy I gave my other jobs to another plumber) or should I let him know Im going to complain to Gas Safe? P.S he hasnt given certificate yet either but I guess legally he has 30 days to do this so I can't do anything about this until the time is up - as it was a cash job he said he can't give me reciept either although previously he confirmed in text that he could give me a receipt - any advice on how to deal with this situation?
Click to expand...
I cannot see this is a Gsr issue
the rest of your post seems to relate to a MagnaClean filter
it really does not matter where these second rate filters are fitted , flow or return they will do as they say on the box.

I presume you had a fixed price quotation before you engaged your GSR engineer so you BOTH understood your mutual
obligations to each other

centralheatking
 
Rob Foster said:
I cannot see this is a Gsr issue
the rest of your post seems to relate to a MagnaClean filter
it really does not matter where these second rate filters are fitted , flow or return they will do as they say on the box.

I presume you had a fixed price quotation before you engaged your GSR engineer so you BOTH understood your mutual
obligations to each other

centralheatking
Click to expand...
Second rate in your own personal opinions you mean. I think they are top draw mate and so do many others.
 
Harvest Fields said:
That isn’t a gas safe issue. Also I’m sure you can fit an Adey filter anywhere. But it is preferred on the return as that is where it will do the best job. Post the pictures that you have and I will have a look.
Click to expand...

Hi Harvest Fields - attached pics of magna cleaner + cold water tank (which was supposed to have been cleaned)

IMG-20190513-WA0000.jpg


20190513_173656.jpg


20190513_173614.jpg
 
Rob Foster said:
I cannot see this is a Gsr issue
the rest of your post seems to relate to a MagnaClean filter
it really does not matter where these second rate filters are fitted , flow or return they will do as they say on the box.

I presume you had a fixed price quotation before you engaged your GSR engineer so you BOTH understood your mutual
obligations to each other

centralheatking
Click to expand...
Hi Rob - yes we did have a fixed price for the list of work mentioned and I have the trace of conversations however putting aside the magna cleaner placement - the cold water tank has not been cleaned either and this was part of the agreed works.

If they don't fix the issue I guess trading standards is my only option- I have paid for a service that has not been done. I posted in this forum to get a second opinion of the work completed before I start questioning the plumber as I don't have knowledge in this field and the last thing I want to do is make someone upset by questioning their work.
 
newgal85 said:
It has the cover on now - it was removed temporarily because we had underfloor heating installed today so I took the picture whilst they were mid way through the work.
Click to expand...

were them lads gas safe reg?
 
bogrodder said:
There’s no legal requirement to issue you with a certificate.. even for a new install.
Click to expand...
Hi Bogrodder - I calles Gas Safe customer services they said all registered engineers must issue in 30 days? They said if its being moved they must be notified so the council can be informed of the move - is that incorrect?
 
newgal85 said:
Yes they were - hopefully I dont get any further problems have enough to deal with right now!
Click to expand...

other than what you have said did they tell you they spotted anything else / general quality of install etc?
 
ShaunCorbs said:
other than what you have said did they tell you they spotted anything else / general quality of install etc?
Click to expand...
They just mentioned to me that magna cleaner should be in the other pipe and the cold water tank has not been cleaned as agreed. The one thing they said has been done right is the pressurizing of the heating system.They did say something about the pipes used as well but didnt go into detail after that.
 
Riley said:
It needs notifying though
Click to expand...

Hello Riley,

About 2 years after the requirement to notify the installation of Gas Boilers first became a legal requirement I moved a Boiler which had been installed and notified a year previously from a Kitchen to the back wall of a newly built extension.

Although I believed that this should definitely be notified because of certifying that it had been moved / reinstalled by a CORGI registered Gas Engineer / Installer and that all pertinent Gas Safety Regulations and Building Regulations had been adhered to there was some debate about this with a couple of friends / colleagues who were Heating Engineers / Gas Engineers so I telephoned the CORGI Technical Helpline to confirm my stance on the matter.

The CORGI Technical representative disagreed with me - He was stating that an already notified Gas Boiler that was moved but still in the same Household / Building did not need to be notified because in His opinion the notification process was to ensure that only Condensing Boilers were being installed [apart from where there were dispensations for difficult circumstances] and as the Boiler had already been notified there was no need to re-confirm that it was still installed at the same address.

I stated that this would mean that Boilers could be moved by Non CORGI Registered Operatives - there would be no record of the `Gas Appliance Works`and that the installation might not meet the appropriate Gas Safety Regulations / Building Regulations.

He stated something like - `How many Boilers get moved within the same Home ?` - `probably not enough to be concerned about`.

I was not happy with that response and I went ahead and notified the Boiler move / re-installation.

I should have phoned again and spoken to a different `CORGI Technical Advisor` to see whether that attitude / `advice` was just that of the individual that I spoke to or also that of another CORGI Technical Advisor.

At that time and probably still now with Gas Safe there was no point in trying to discuss this with the CORGI Gas Appliance Notification Telephone representatives as they were `Notification Admin Only` Employees with no Technical knowledge on Gas Boiler Installation notifications or any other Gas Safety / Gas Utilisation Technical matter.

As I mentioned this was quite a few Years ago and although I personally have only moved 5 or 6 Gas Boilers within the same premises since then they have all been notified and registered as having been moved / re-installed by a Gas Safe registered Gas Engineer / Me complying with all applicable regulations.

I feel sure that We are correct that a Gas Boiler which is moved within the same Home / Building should definitely be notified for the reasons described in my second paragraph above and I hope that Gas Safe Technical would give confirmation of that.

Chris
 
My shorter response is that I saw a gas safe inspector recently and he said whenever moved needs notifying
 
CHRISX said:
Hello Riley,

About 2 years after the requirement to notify the installation of Gas Boilers first became a legal requirement I moved a Boiler which had been installed and notified a year previously from a Kitchen to the back wall of a newly built extension.

Although I believed that this should definitely be notified because of certifying that it had been moved / reinstalled by a CORGI registered Gas Engineer / Installer and that all pertinent Gas Safety Regulations and Building Regulations had been adhered to there was some debate about this with a couple of friends / colleagues who were Heating Engineers / Gas Engineers so I telephoned the CORGI Technical Helpline to confirm my stance on the matter.

The CORGI Technical representative disagreed with me - He was stating that an already notified Gas Boiler that was moved but still in the same Household / Building did not need to be notified because in His opinion the notification process was to ensure that only Condensing Boilers were being installed [apart from where there were dispensations for difficult circumstances] and as the Boiler had already been notified there was no need to re-confirm that it was still installed at the same address.

I stated that this would mean that Boilers could be moved by Non CORGI Registered Operatives - there would be no record of the `Gas Appliance Works`and that the installation might not meet the appropriate Gas Safety Regulations / Building Regulations.

He stated something like - `How many Boilers get moved within the same Home ?` - `probably not enough to be concerned about`.

I was not happy with that response and I went ahead and notified the Boiler move / re-installation.

I should have phoned again and spoken to a different `CORGI Technical Advisor` to see whether that attitude / `advice` was just that of the individual that I spoke to or also that of another CORGI Technical Advisor.

At that time and probably still now with Gas Safe there was no point in trying to discuss this with the CORGI Gas Appliance Notification Telephone representatives as they were `Notification Admin Only` Employees with no Technical knowledge on Gas Boiler Installation notifications or any other Gas Safety / Gas Utilisation Technical matter.

As I mentioned this was quite a few Years ago and although I personally have only moved 5 or 6 Gas Boilers within the same premises since then they have all been notified and registered as having been moved / re-installed by a Gas Safe registered Gas Engineer / Me complying with all applicable regulations.

I feel sure that We are correct that a Gas Boiler which is moved within the same Home / Building should definitely be notified for the reasons described in my second paragraph above and I hope that Gas Safe Technical would give confirmation of that.

Chris
Click to expand...
Thanks Chris! Will follow up with Gas Safe to check if they have been notified yet-
 
Riley said:
My shorter response is that I saw a gas safe inspector recently and he said whenever moved needs notifying
Click to expand...

Hello again Riley,

I know that We are correct in that Boilers that are moved must be notified.

I have just remembered [checked some paperwork] that I used one of the Boilers that I moved some years ago as an example `Gas Works` for a CORGI Inspection and one more recently for a Gas Safe Inspection.

As I was writing my `Story` above I wondered how many Gas Engineers / Installers were given that wrong `information` by the CORGI Technical Advisor and never bothered to check whether it was correct and since then never notified any Boiler that they moved within the same Home / Building ?

Although it is a long time ago now it was disgraceful that the CORGI Technical Advisor alluded to - `perhaps there are not enough non -notified Boiler moves within the same premises to be concerned about` - as ONE badly installed Gas Appliance can Kill !

It has occurred to me that if some Heating Engineers / Gas Engineers asked a question of Gas Safe Technical unless it was a very contentious subject whatever answer they received would form their `future knowledge` / guidelines to be followed in the future ?

Hopefully there is no incorrect information given out by the Gas Safe Technical Helpline so no future problems can occur related to misinterpretations of the Gas Regulations / applicable Building Regulations.

Chris
 
Harvest Fields said:
That connector shouldn’t be on the condense pipe either. It should be solvent and as Shaun said. Where the UFH people Gas Safe?
Click to expand...
I thought I had posted this the other day but cannot see it?
Anyway, I have never heard that compression fittings are not allowed, is this definite and where does ir say so?
Some guys even say, wrongly IMO, SW should not be used as the condense can attack the glue.

I often fitted a compression near the boiler to aid disconnection in the future.
 
To be fair the speedfit coupling is fine and acceptable

Not that I would use one
 
Harvest Fields said:
Same as push fit in my eyes. Still has a rubber seal. Would never fit or recommend it done that one.
Click to expand...

True but most condense in boilers are done with orings and clips / pushfit etc
 
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