advice on setting out for myself

[Jimwants2plumb]

Hi,

I work in I.T and I am fed up of working for absolute Richard Craniums who treat people like dirt and basically working for big business. So in brief, I am prepared to work very, very hard, learn a hell of a lot and build up a small business I can be proud of.

I am about to start to train so I can soon start my own plumbing/gas/renewable business. I won’t be doing an apprentice, as I am to old and have to many existing commitments. Even though I am setting up on my own, I want to give the trade the absolute upmost respect it deserves. So even though there is a hell of lot I will need to learn afterwards I want to start by doing things properly. So I want to do NVQ to lv3.

I just have a couple of questions i was wondering if you could muck in with and chat about.

1. Does Anyone know any private tuition places (pref family/small established business) north west: manc, liverpool, warrington, lancs, blackpool etc where I can train right through to ACS and gas registered? I have a good friend who owns his own heating/plumbing company I can work for, for a month or so once I am fully done to get a base of real life experience.

2. Is the plumbing trade struggling at the moment? I have read alot on here which suggests yes and no, so is there a formal body which details the state of the trade at any one time? I am not in a dream world and expect to make “my fortune” but I want to make a living for myself and my family.

3. Anyone suggest a good place to learn about the installation of renewables?

4. What would your advice be for people saying they want to start up on their own? “Are you mad”, “never looked back” etc.

Please get back as I have loads to ask but just don’t want to overload the questions right now…

Thanks V much.

 

[Dan]

Welcome to Plumbing Forum | Plumbing Advice | Plumbers Forums | A forum for plumbers advice in the UK!

Welcome to UKPlumbersForums.co.uk Jimwants2plumb. Thanks for introducing yourself.

 

[newbie1]

sorry but you must be mad
trade is on its knees seriously

 

[dontknowitall]

Hate to sound a pessimist, but I agree with Newbie1. There was a sort of survey done recently on here where about 1 in 8 who went on a plumbing course actually made some sort of success from it. Most of the others went back to their previous careers.

The construction world is very different from IT (one of my backgrounds). If you do make it past the first few months work doesn't suddenly come piling in - it's a struggle for a good 2 years. The main reason to me seems to be the lack of housebuilding (seems like around 10% are built now compared to 5-6 years ago). So those plumbers who worked with the likes of Bellway have now turned self employed which has flooded the market for those who are doing normal domestic plumbing.

Plumbing courses teach you the extreme basics. They do not touch floorboards, how to remove/replace, or drilling holes through masonry, or what happens when a stop tap fails, or how to change a tap when you can't turn the water off, or how to wire an immersion heater, etc., etc. For many in the construction industry this is pretty easy stuff but for someone in offices and computers it's very different. The same can be said for a builder trying to use a computer. Would you advise a builder to retrain as a website developer? The training's fairly basic, but the competition to get those jobs is just as heated as the construction world.

The recession has also altered customers. Most are putting of building projects and just making do and mending. Are you thinking of buying a replacement/new car? Probably not, like the rest of us. You're probably waiting until the future is more certain. The same goes for home owners and landlords.

It's not that there is no new building going on - just the competition to get it is fairly intense and to get these jobs you have to cut your labour costs or someone will beat your quote.

If you're thinking about renewables, think about the customer (or yourself in a customer's position). Would you prefer to buy from a new company that just sells these services or would you prefer to buy from a company that's got many years of general heating experience and has started to install renewables? There's a company I know of that started in renewables a year or so ago. They fit one installation a month over 3-4 days. The rest of the month is standard plumbing and most of that comes from recommendation. Renewables is the latest thing but it's not as popular as people try to make it out to be.

I'm not saying you won't make it. I'd like to be proved wrong, but the simple fact is there is no easy way to making a fortune in plumbing. Most of us are happy just to get to an average wage at the moment as life is pretty tough.

If you do choose this route though, best of luck.

 

[Jimwants2plumb]

Thanks, honesty is truly appreciated.
I realise it’s a world apart from IT but do appreciate you highlighting how much so, I am under no illusion about that. The trouble with me is my glass if always half full, so thought I should ask people who know much more than I do as usually I would just go and do it.

I am looking to learn a new trade. I enjoy engineering so that’s what has gripped me about plumbing. I just know I want a complete change and to work for myself. The whole office thing, especially office politics just kills me. Also its not just about money, I am not under an illusion that you do 1 course and earn 60k per yeat, I really just want to work for myself.

I am currently saving for a course (of hopefully plumbing), but typically saving just to make sure I can and will change what I do.
If the blue party get in funding for building etc may be even less… LETS HOPE NOT!

I will keep my toe in coming on the forum. I will also look at training 4 an electrician simply as an option, but don’t mean to swear and it does not appear as interesting when you read about it etc.

thanks so much for the responses... much valued

 

[John t]

welcome to the forum Jim
good luck mate

 

[oldplumber]

cant you combine it/plumbing for a few years and go to college twice a week evenings or one day a week, do your nvq 2 and 3 through your mate weekends etc.
Costs a lot less esp if the college helps with the finance or you get some euro pean funding via the college, I did and it paid for both my level 2 and 3 nvqs and the college paid fdor the tuition for my 6129 tech certs. Because i was on a college course I got a discount on my ccn1 and 4 appliances, only cost around £250 all in, and got wras/unvented for £45 each or less. Allowed me to learn, train and build up my business over 3 - 4 years so that when I finally started full time I had a small customer base which is still growing and the gas work is the main earner now. I cant fathom why the world and his dog wants to fork out thousands for 12 weeks training and think they can then set off and earn a living. One day a week over 4 years is the same time give or take sitting at a desk or in the workshop, but most important you have time to go out on site with others and learn the real job. Any problems and you nip back to college and chat to the tutors, and over four years thats a lot of valuable backup. I wouldnt expect your 12 week providers would offer a similar support line 2 years after you finish paying them. I now have one ortwo works experience lads from the college with me when I have suitable work on, but theres not enough on at present to take on an apprentice, and Id only shoot them if I had to work with them trailing around behind me fulltime at present. This still allows me a contact with the college even though ive long gone but its useful when your stuck up ****s creek at times. If you want to change roles and to still support a family, 12 weeks at a private provider in this climate is not the way to start. Believe me, and I only really hopped on the ladder 5/6 years back , when i was 45, and I had had loads of experience prior to change to plumbing fulltime, by renovating houses and converting flats (prior to banks cocking it all up). Any how good luck and refer back to all the previous threads for more info

 

[Jimwants2plumb]

Hello,

Thanks v much old plumber... Appreciated.

I could go to college in the evenings, but my dependencies are not children, its my mum, so because I work I believe (as far as I can tell) funding would not be widely available to me. Therefore the college route would actually still cost me quite alot, and would also take a heck of allot longer, and I still would be sat in my office job in the day, as I mention below, I do not think a plumbers mate job etc would simply cover all of my immovable responsibilities.

If I go college in the evening and do my 6129 (or the new qual as from sep), my worry is that I would earn no where near enough if working as a junior plumber-member of a firm/team/small business etc to pay for mortgage, etc, etc.

I want to learn the trade and agree that after 12 weeks I may know enough to pass a practical assessment in a perfectly laid out technical area, but have yet to go truly into the field.

I guess its just because I am so determined I feel its possible. To learn as you go (not learn it in 12 weeks - I respect the trade and no enough to know you need more than that under your belt).

I understand it taking a few years to build a customer base & skills up, so my question is...

Is there a certain level of wet plumbing, and say a focus on gas engineering (so cat 3 on the gas register) that would enable me to start out on my own, earning from services, detection-repair (with say additional baxi, supplier training etc) landlord certs, bathroom installs/swaps and then build from there?

I was going to attempt to save 20k (I have about 12 p and a bag of hula hoops at the mo), leave my job with enough technical knowledge to do manageable (for me) wet plumbing jobs and focus on the gas/heating side of things ( I am aware of courses which get you to cat3 on the gas register and sign off your portfolio as you learn in house), then build up my plumbing/renewable port folio from there?

Is it really unrealistic to think it’s a credible approach?

 

[Keithyos]

Wow Jim I'm in a very similar position.

Found the questions and answers here really useful. I have looked at the private company courses and they will take £4500 to give you the current Tech Certs and another £1200 to provide the NVQ assessment to your work as you complete your portfolio of project work for yourself, friends and family. I guess the next step after that is to advertise and hope that recommendations come in from previous projects. I plan to try this approach while still working the IT day job, so just taking the smaller weekend and evening type jobs that have been covered by the tech certs, and build up confidence and experience while joining night classes to build up further tech skills.

Let me know how you get on and what you decide, its all good stuff. By the way I’m in the Loughborough area, does any one have experience of working in this area.

Good luck
Cheers Keith

 

[Jimwants2plumb]

Hi,

Keith, what companies have you considerd for training?

Loads of them are way to sales orientated in thier aggressive approach. OLCI were way to aggressive for me.

let me know, be good to share experience.

Jim

 

[Keithyos]

Hi Jim

Thanks for the reply.

I am thinking of using OLCI its the one in Mansfield Nottinghamshire, had one good report so far, what advice and alternatives are there that you know of. Any recommendations before I splash the cash. LOL.


Keep in touch because it sounds like we are very much about to go down a similar route. I wish you well and knowledge is power. Chee

 

[oldplumber]

my advice to you both is to go and talk to your local colleges first and see if they can offer financial support etc and then compare the costs against the private colleges. reember that the industry is reducing and work is scarce and your college that you are throwing money at my not be there next week, or worse still just change the name board outside and carryon under a new name having taken your money, liquidated and restarted again. Local colleges are there for the long term, they invest oney in the infrastructure all the time and are normally way ahead of the private boys. My localcollege has only last year installed a complete green fully funtioning house to show off and train on all the newer green systems.

 

[Keithyos]

Thanks, good advice will check them out too. Let you know how I get on laters
Cheers