No central heating

[garethd]

Afternoon plumbers, after some help please.


I’ve purchased a 1950’s property which has no access to mains gas (two bedrooms, only bathroom downstairs). It’s a bit worse for ware, but the misses fell in love with it so I didn’t get a lot of choice. However, it doesn’t have any central heating (apart from one storage heater in the corridor).


It does have an open fire with a back boiler to heat the hot water (although it can only get it lukewarm). There is a hot water tank with an immersion heater but we don’t use it due to the cost. All the cold water seems to run off the mains (no cold water tank in loft). The shower is electric, I have to put the cold water tap on a bit to release some pressure so it can heat the water sufficiently (even though it 9.8KW).


Suffice to say it all needs an overhaul. Ideally I’d like some form of central heating and hot water that doesn’t cost a fortune. I’m completely stumped as to what to do next, I’ve been looking on the internet at various options, but I’m getting a bit overloaded with information. I’m not sure who I can turn to for some independent advice.


We’ve put aside 7K to put in a new system of some sort. My best idea so far would be to put in a wood stove in place of the open fire (plenty of cheap wood in the area) with a back boiler and install radiators to run off it and also heat the hot water. Then also install a solar heater for hot water in the summer, I can then get rid of the rubbish electric shower. Although it all looks very expensive and complicated.


Any advice on where to start, who to go to or what to put in would be gratefully received !

 

[Barry98]

Welcome to the forums , where are you based am sure there will be a member on hear near you that can best advise

 

[garethd]

Thanks BOD, I'm near Newbury in West Berks.

 

[Mrs Tara Plumbi]

I see no one has come back to you.
Something like more than 90% of houses in England have either mains gas or LPG so you are unique!
I would have thought if you are not on mains gas then you should be extra conscious about insulating your home throughout.
There are so many unknown factors about your house, your lifestyle, your taste...
but a couple of things I would consider are:

1. Electric underfloor heating system - cheap to install (you can DIY) no maintenance costs and it could last longer than you do - take these factors into account when you think that the cost of running electric heating is more.
Electric UF heating would be better than rads because of the way you experience the heat.
2. Air to air heat pumps or some kind of heat pump system. Some people are not impressed wit them but others have good experience - worth thinking about.
See this Wocester Bosch clip about air-air heat pumps Tara Heating and Plumbing in Thanet, east kent: Air to Air Heat Pumps for Air Conditioning & Heating

I might think of combining 1 or/and 2 and your wood stove.

Find out what others do in your area - what are they doing in new house builds in your area?

 

[GasmanxxxR1]

check out wood chip boilers

 

[GasmanxxxR1]

or electric boilers, not sure of the running costs though

 

[Richie_77]

I'd go oil or LPG. Wood burners are a pain and just not as easy as just flicking a switch.
As for air and ground source heat pumps the ones I've worked with have been disappointing at best. Even the rep from dakin and there commissioning engineer told me they'd never fit them in there own houses.
From what I've been told there expensive unreliable and under perform.

 

[lame plumber]

dont tell those quoting your budget coz youll find the quotes will be very close or more lol

 

[TBServices]

You could get a very good oil/LPG system for that money. You may want to consider Multi fuel if you have access to wood etc, or a south facing roof for solar.

 

[rab250]

I would advise an lpg bulk store and combi or system boiler for the summer months and a dunsley link up system so you can utilise your solid fuel stove for the winter/colder months. The biomass system is the future i recon but your probably aout 30k shy in the old money department.

 

[lame plumber]

I would advise an lpg bulk store and combi or system boiler for the summer months and a dunsley link up system so you can utilise your solid fuel stove for the winter/colder months. The biomass system is the future i recon but your probably aout 30k shy in the old money department.

personally Id go for oil, cheaper per unit than lpg and far far less than electric boiler set up. combine with a solar water panel set up for some green savings.. I am still unsure of bio mass pellet systems as the pellets arent cheap, just a renewable source of fuel with similar costs to oil/lpg to buy in. It only those who own their own woodland that can benefit fully from wood burners really

 

[Gray0689]

You could look in to wood pellet stoves you can get some to do hot water and heating
And then your solar for summer when you don't want the heat from stove

 

[Mrs Tara Plumbi]

It is not an area we work in - all mains gas round here.
But I read all sorts of irrelevant stuff and I remember reading that oil boilers are on the way out - in that - a new oil boiler should only be installed if it is replacing an existing.
That it doesn't make sense to do not oil-boiler installations from scratch.

Where did I read this - I can't recall - it could be WB.
Heat pumps - i know there is a lot of bad press but some very good press too - IF MAINS gas is not an option. Worth investigating more. I would look to Worcester Bosch for info (but possibly install a different brand).
But perhaps heat pumps are pants.
I don't know!

 

[Gray0689]

It is not an area we work in - all mains gas round here.
But I read all sorts of irrelevant stuff and I remember reading that oil boilers are on the way out - in that - a new oil boiler should only be installed if it is replacing an existing.
That it doesn't make sense to do not oil-boiler installations from scratch.

Where did I read this - I can't recall - it could be WB.
Heat pumps - i know there is a lot of bad press but some very good press too - IF MAINS gas is not an option. Worth investigating more. I would look to Worcester Bosch for info (but possibly install a different brand).
But perhaps heat pumps are pants.
I don't know!

Don't know where you read it but its not true Northern Ireland has lots and lots of oil boilers as does republic and then there is all the rural areas in England Scotland and Wales

 

[Killy Bing]

It is not an area we work in - all mains gas round here.
But I read all sorts of irrelevant stuff and I remember reading that oil boilers are on the way out - in that - a new oil boiler should only be installed if it is replacing an existing.
That it doesn't make sense to do not oil-boiler installations from scratch.

Where did I read this - I can't recall - it could be WB.
Heat pumps - i know there is a lot of bad press but some very good press too - IF MAINS gas is not an option. Worth investigating more. I would look to Worcester Bosch for info (but possibly install a different brand).
But perhaps heat pumps are pants.
I don't know!

Ehh! Im based in maidstone and the majority of my work is oil in the surrounding areas.
just a little way of the beaten track and theres no mains gas in most places.

remember forking out for a heat pump costs quite alot, landlords dont want biomass for propertys but at the same time tenents are put off of renting a property with an lpg boiler ddue to the running costs!

oil tends to be the better of the two evils.

i fully agree if theres mains gas you would be mad not using it.

 

[TBServices]

Isn't the higher fuel price of LPG offset by the higher install and servicing costs of oil?

 

[Gray0689]

Isn't the higher fuel price of LPG offset by the higher install and servicing costs of oil?

Higher install cost but not a higher servicing charge
Oil boilers are pretty simple things to work on

 

[TBServices]

I thought they would be dearer due to nozzles being replaced etc. also read a lot on here about badly maintained oil appliances costing a fortune, although a lot of the time it's agas etc.

 

[jase158]

what is powering the back boiler?

 

[Killy Bing]

what is powering the back boiler?

From the op's description it would be a woodstove with a back boiler

 

[garethd]

Thanks all for the advice.


The back boiler currently runs off an open fire.


Done some digging and it seems most people in the area are using oil, electric heating combined with wood burners. Looks like the easiest solutions is a few storage heaters in the bedrooms and a wood burner downstairs.

 

[Pipes Plumbing]

It comes down to how you want to interact with the system and your lifestyle to a large extent...

If you want a system that you can fit and forget in terms of heat timing and servicing you have the options of oil, lpg or wood pellet, but if you don't mind feeding a wood burner to generate heat (and have space for fuel storage to get bulk pricing) there are great wood / anthracite boiler stoves out there that would meet your needs. These can be had with outputs to 26kw to water plus a portion to the room directly - logs can be the cheapest of all fuels too.

these will run rads and a cylinder on their own or can utilise a thermal store / accumulator to store heat for when it's needed later...
also, they can link easily with an oil / lpg boiler to provide a flexible half way house between each system.

Feel free to PM me if you are interested in going down the solid fuel / biomass route and i'll be happy to advise & potentially survey the site for you to work out the heat load and available options for you...

 

[Dotty]

I'd steer well clear of biomass. Most models require you to rake them out every few days or they'll quickly clog up.

Box ticking exercise imho.

 

[lame plumber]

wood pellets. take one tree, move it across the country, chop it up using lots of electricity, push it all back together and dry them, more leccy then cart the result all over the country, loads of fuel and then flog them to some poor sucker for more than the cost of oil per unit of energy (joule or kw), renewables are wonderful