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Simple college question

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Mr learner

Hi I'm on a heating and vent course and I have a question I'm stuck on

Describe the procedure you would follow for flushing a new installation?

Any help is appreciated

The question is part of a domestic cold water assignment

I don't know anything about flushing so this next bit may sound stupid
Is there a flush that you do on the water side like hot and cold water to taps and cylinder
Then another for the radiators and f+e

Thanks
 
I assume this is refering to cleaning the flux and other stuff out from the pipes when you're soldering.

I do this by leaving an open end, fitting an isolation valve in its closed position, then turning water on. Then I get a bucket, open isolation valve, fill half the bucket, close valve and job done.
 
Sorry for the extra question

Is a stop valve a stopcock I think it is but I'm not sure


Cheers
 
Only if it has a Stop sign on it ...





Sorry ... I jest!!

Yes, it's the PC (politically correct) version!!!
 
Mr learner said:
Sorry for the extra question

Is a stop valve a stopcock I think it is but I'm not sure


Cheers
Click to expand...

i would say so, it will be on the rising cold main, a gatevalve will be on the cold feed and cold storage, ( i know some/most will advise against fitting gate valves and would prefer full bore quarter turn valves, but when doing college assignments they will mention gate valves)
 
dontknowitall said:
Only if it has a Stop sign on it ...





Sorry ... I jest!!

Yes, it's the PC (politically correct) version!!!
Click to expand...

i kid you not when i worked in the college we had some hassle with some of the terminology we used, ie ballcock, nipple, male thread, female thread etc etc, all long used industry accepted terms, the PC brigade were tasked with checking EVERY document in the whole college before the impending HMIE visit, and they knocked it all back, apparently they had a software prog that scanned and read every document in every department to highlight anything that wasnt "correct" haha it must have went into melt down when it read ours, it took hours of meeting from the hard of plumbing to get the ok for the terms to be used, pathetic
 
Schools have had the same problem. They couldn't google essex or other places like that for the same reasons.
 
Thanks guys everyone seems to call everything by different names
Worst was the ballafix/service valve/isolation valve that had me confused for a bit lol

On an indirect cold water system is this correct when it enters the house it has a stopcock then it has another stopcock at the cwsu

Then the cold feed/distribution have gate valves

I think it just has 1 stopcock were the main enters but I just read that your supposed to use a stopcock on mains pressure is that true

It's these simple questions that are killing me I'm on nvq
 
2 supposed to be working with a plumber but can't find an apprenticeship so I'm struggling a bit

Sorry for second post entered one before by accident
 
Mr learner said:
Thanks guys everyone seems to call everything by different names
Worst was the ballafix/service valve/isolation valve that had me confused for a bit lol

On an indirect cold water system is this correct when it enters the house it has a stopcock then it has another stopcock at the cwsu

Then the cold feed/distribution have gate valves

I think it just has 1 stopcock were the main enters but I just read that your supposed to use a stopcock on mains pressure is that true

It's these simple questions that are killing me I'm on nvq
Click to expand...


in the good old days, we fitted stopcocks on main and gate valves on everything else, some blocks of tenements etc only had one main stopcock in the bottom house for the main, and everything needed to be turned off and drained down if any repair was done on the cold, with gatevaleve in the loft for the communal cold feed to all the bathrooms and a gatevalve on each cylider cold feed, with the drive to save water (and labour costs) over the yrs we started fitting valves everywhere to minimise water loss and to avoid access probs, it is acceptable to fit wither a stopcock or (good quality) quarter turn service valve on the inlet to the CWST, then fit gate valves on all pipes in the loft coming out the tank (remember to label them) and then also fit additional gate valves beside each cylinder and inside each flat for the cold storage, from memory gate valves are not used on mains because of the way they shut down as it causes the water to shudder to a halt, where as in a stopcock the water is slowly decreased till it stops (someone will advise exactly why the different valves are used)
PS on the stopcock at the point of entry you should include a check valve above the stopcock then a drain valve above that
 
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There is a difference between a service valve and an isolation valve! The service valve has an extra extension with a nut on it so it can be used with a ball valve. An isolation valve is a valve that's used on a pipe to stop water from going further through the pipe. (The service valve stops water going to the serviced item (ball valve or WC inlet).

Loads to learn and the plumber who says he knows everything ... doesn't! Some plumbers' knowledge though is MUCH better than others! (I'm at the bottom of the heap in this one.)
 
kirkgas said:
i kid you not when i worked in the college we had some hassle with some of the terminology we used, ie ballcock, nipple, male thread, female thread etc etc, all long used industry accepted terms, the PC brigade were tasked with checking EVERY document in the whole college before the impending HMIE visit, and they knocked it all back, apparently they had a software prog that scanned and read every document in every department to highlight anything that wasnt "correct" haha it must have went into melt down when it read ours, it took hours of meeting from the hard of plumbing to get the ok for the terms to be used, pathetic
Click to expand...

I don't think i would have been too polite if they had mentioned it. What a society we are turning in to.
A stop valve could mean any type of valve. It is ridiculous.

Whilst on the subject. The guy over the back from me has bought himself a couple of hens and a henerel (he is that stupid he doesn't know he won't get many eggs when a henerel is about) but this thing wakes up about 5 in the morning and starts shouting at the moon.
I think i'm going to end up cooking it for him. He can watch if he likes.:mad:
 
Jesus had 2 read that lot 3 times lol there's crap loads to learn

So just to clarify on the cold feed to cylinder would I have a gate valve next to the cylinder with a drain cock

Also What does a check valve do does it slow the pressure down (just a guess) :)

Is the service valve a ballafix valve used on basins ect

And what is the isolation valves job

Don't worry there my last questions for now :)

Cheers
 
the check valve stops the water going back into the main supply (technically it is a one way valve) thats why you need stopcock then check valve then drain valve in that order, (if you swap check and drain valves round the water wont drain from the vertical pipe as it cant get back through the check valve) if the water is turned off outside, you use a single check valve above the main stopcock as the water is claen but might not be fresh if mixed back into the supply that might go next door, you use a double check valve where clean water can be contaminated from soiled water,
 
Mr learner said:
Jesus had 2 read that lot 3 times lol there's crap loads to learn

So just to clarify on the cold feed to cylinder would I have a gate valve next to the cylinder with a drain cock
Maybe yes maybe no. It may be in the loft next to the tank. I hate people who fit drain cocks but less than the ones who fit nothing. Do it right with a sludge valve to outside.

Also What does a check valve do does it slow the pressure down (just a guess) :)
It checks (stops) the water backflowing. A double check valve is like belt and braces. " 2 check valves in the one fitting with a test point between them.
Is the service valve a ballafix valve used on basins ect
A service valve can be any type of valve that lets you cut the supply at point of use. Generally ballofix type (genuine ballofix are not seen too often on domestic) valves are used for neatness.

And what is the isolation valves job
As it says on the tin
Don't worry there my last questions for now :)
Fill yer boots i'm on a roll :D

Cheers
Click to expand...

Kirk
Any jobs :D
 
Tamz what work are you after?
our install dept are fitting boilers all over the place, edinburgh today and tomorrow, the boss might be looking for subs in different areas, not sure what the dosh is like TBH, i try to stay in the fluffy training side rather than get involved in the "real work" i have your email address, once i have spoken to him i will send you an email, might not come to anything but might be worth a wee chat with him
 
Thanks guys I've learned more in the last 1 hour than I did at college today haha
It's helped me understand things a lot better

On the cold feed from cwsu I add the gate valve to the top were it comes out of the cwsu then a drainoff next to the cylinder is that right

Also what's the procedure for carrying out maintenance

Is it just visual checks
 
Mr learner said:
Thanks guys I've learned more in the last 1 hour than I did at college today haha
It's helped me understand things a lot better

On the cold feed from cwsu I add the gate valve to the top were it comes out of the cwsu then a drainoff next to the cylinder is that right
Thats about it. Btw this is a sludge cock
 sludge cock.JPG
Also what's the procedure for carrying out maintenance
Usually "if it aint broke don't fix it" or go with the flow

Is it just visual checks
Click to expand...
They won't be long in knowing if there is a leak. Otherwise check things are working as they should . Valves, taps etc. Operation of flush valves and whatever else you can think of to kill an hour or two. Check for small weeps around compression joints, look for green or brown streaks left from leaks that dry up.
In 30 odd years i have never been asked to carry out a visual check but i'd be up for it if the money was right.
 
on a drawing it is fine to draw a wee bow tie next to the cylinder to show a drain valve, however as Tamz says, they are a nightmare to work on as they tend to stick shut and even if we can open them you usually need a curry tub under it and then tip that into a bucket whick takes forever to drain a cylinder, far better to actually run a 15mm pipe to outside with a sludge/drain valve on it to drain quickly when required, ( a sludge valve is a term we use up here, it is a quarter turn valve that is robust and unlikely to jam shut, and if it does then a bit of welly will release it)
 
Jesus you read my mind I was writing the question and you already answered lol
Quality
 
kirkgas said:
Tamz what work are you after?
our install dept are fitting boilers all over the place, edinburgh today and tomorrow, the boss might be looking for subs in different areas, not sure what the dosh is like TBH, i try to stay in the fluffy training side rather than get involved in the "real work" i have your email address, once i have spoken to him i will send you an email, might not come to anything but might be worth a wee chat with him
Click to expand...

Cheers for the offer Kirk but i have as much as i want to cope with. Booking stuff into March now. I would speak to the guy tho.

Just thinking of my old age and the aching joints. I'm not getting any younger.:( There are easier ways to make a living and i always fancied being a teacher (especially if i get a belt) but i couldn't do with someone telling me what to do. Too set in my ways i suppose but maybe in the future. Had an offer to do the ACS assessor stuff with all the training given, even as a part time thing but turned it down. We'll see.
 
Top man thank you all for the help I think I've got this assignment covered

I'll be back soon with more questions though lol keeps you all on your toes

Going to be knackered tomorrow I work as a painter and have to rub down a few ceilings tomorrow morning

I can't wait to be a plumber :)
 
tamz said:
Cheers for the offer Kirk but i have as much as i want to cope with. Booking stuff into March now. I would speak to the guy tho.

Just thinking of my old age and the aching joints. I'm not getting any younger.:( There are easier ways to make a living and i always fancied being a teacher (especially if i get a belt) but i couldn't do with someone telling me what to do. Too set in my ways i suppose but maybe in the future. Had an offer to do the ACS assessor stuff with all the training given, even as a part time thing but turned it down. We'll see.
Click to expand...

never one to suggest you have made a mistake as it couldnt have been right for you at the time, however i thoroughly enjoy describing how to carry a 1600x 600 k2 rad up 3 flights of stairs and humphing an ideal mexico back down on a sack barrow as oppossed to actually doing it now haha, on the gas as well it isnt everyones cup of tea, but i find it more interesting than real work, part time is a great way into it to see if yuo like it, i started off when i worked as carillion gas manager working in a training centre as an when required at nights and weekends which allowed me to learn slow and steady, went through A1 and V1 there as he needed me to assess and do paperwork, (A1 and V1 are not like ACS so now that i have them they are for life)
PS no belt allowed, not even allowed to give the boys a row if they are snidey wee gits, you have to send a letter to their employer and give them a wee cuddle)
 
Last edited by a moderator:
kirkgas said:
PS no belt allowed, not even allowed to give the boys a row if they are snidey wee gits, you have to send a letter to their employer and give them a wee cuddle)
Click to expand...

That would be me fkd then.
I'd want to drag them out to their da and straighten it out.:p

I sub to Carillion doing some big stuff. Have done since they took over McAlpines but they have now lost the EMS stuff to Turriff and most are being touped over in the next 3 or 4 weeks. I'll still be in there tho.
 
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