Wood pellet boiler

[tickdoc]

Just wondering what yous guys think of wood pellet boilers and if they are worthwhile as far as running costs , effeciency, reliability and do they heat as good as oil does. I know someone who has a old oil boiler that needs replaced and has possibly been offered a wood pellet boiler for free under a grant.

 

[snowhead]

The main issue with a Pellet boiler is having to fill it regularly with pellets and having somewhere dry to store the pellets.

 

[Jay The Plumber]

I have one, its a 24kw one with a 65kg hopper. needs cleaning out about once a week, filling every other day when used during wintertime. needs almost no cleaning or filling during summer when it runs the DHW only.
Pro's - great for people like me who dont have gas and my location means that even oil is a pain to get (I live the other side of a river with no vehicular access for 70m to the house).

pros:
quick payback on the system cost, around 3-4 years for me
RHI easily covers the cost of the pellets and servicing
'green'

cons:
gotta buy and store pellets
regular filling and cleaning
your control system will be different, you cant use a switched demand type of system so that the boiler responds in the traditional way, you could either make a buffer the demand which acts as a, well, a buffer or leave your zones to work as normal but without swiching the boiler on.off, but run the boiler on timer/manual and demand is fulfilled then.

I use radiators with mine, 2 zones plus a DHW zone, I reckon it would be amazing with UFH.

I have 2 boilers pretty much the same, one of them runs my barn/workshop and that will be registered soon with the commercial RHI.

I have lived with them for a few years now so and specific questions, ill do my best to answer as im sure I will have missed some points.

 

[lame plumber]

so when the rhi is removed, all these boilers will become just another pain in the bum, hence why solid fuel systems have been taken over by gas n oil in recent years only a thought from a pessimist who has seen the wheel invented previously

 

[Jay The Plumber]

so when the rhi is removed, all these boilers will become just another pain in the bum, hence why solid fuel systems have been taken over by gas n oil in recent years only a thought from a pessimist who has seen the wheel invented previously

yea man, oil is dirt cheap now but when I put it in, it was over 65p a litre IIRC.

it will no doubt be replaced and im hoping to get ground source with PV to run the HX

 

[lame plumber]

just teasing, all these things without subsidies arent competitive and the government hasnt any money!!

 

[Jay The Plumber]

all these things without subsidies arent competitive

this. in a nutshell..
if you dont get the MCS sorted and the RHI payments, forget it..

I would have gone oil without the incentives.

 

[SimonG]

Was at a customers today who was considering a pellet boiler last year. She said it didnt go ahead because the rhi was scrapped on pellet boilers.

 

[Jay The Plumber]

Was at a customers today who was considering a pellet boiler last year. She said it didnt go ahead because the rhi was scrapped on pellet boilers.

I know that the rate has dropped on domestic but scrapped? news to me, was talking with my MCS installer the other day about commercial for my workshop and all was still ok

 

[SimonG]

Just what was said. Dont do pellet boilers so dont keep up with the news.

Maybe should have a news section on the forum to help keep everybody upto speed

 

[TVP&H Ltd]

If they're allowed to choose which boiler, there is one on the market that is a direct replacement for an oil boiler. Albeit needing a new location, I.E, back of garage.

 

[snowhead]

Duplicate post

 

[snowhead]

Was at a customers today who was considering a pellet boiler last year. She said it didnt go ahead because the rhi was scrapped on pellet boilers.

Still available, 5.14p per kwh (based on estimated output).
Boiler has to be on the approved list.


Renewable Heat Incentive | Energy Saving Trust


My Son gets around £100 per week RHI payment with a 40kw pellet boiler (pre Jan 2015 install when the rate dropped)
Gives a 3.5 year payback.

 

[Worcester]

We've got two pellet boilers going in at the moment.

In both cases because of the short term price of oil it would be cheaper to run the properties on oil and I have explained that to the clients. In both cases neither believe that the current low oil price (oil is currently cheaper than mains gas) is unsustainable and it will go up again.

As for performance - they usually heat better than oil as properly installed the flow temperature is often higher

How often your boiler needs filling and cleaning is very much down to the make of the boiler.

One is fully automatic feed, self cleaning and just needs flue swept 2 x a year, ash box every 2 - 3 months and a 5 hour maintenance once a year, with a 7 t pellet store he needs just one annual delivery.

The other the client occasionally goes away for up to a week at a time so it has a manual feed 200kg hopper, he has 1T pallet of 10kg bags delivered as and when he needs, and tops up the pellet hopper weekly. It is a 'manual' product needing weekly cleaning and ash box emptying, so it's a once a week job for him. - In his case the current heating in his 14th century 2 bed property is one log burner in the dining room, so we're also installing 8 radiators anda DHW cylinder as part of the whole project.

The RHI is doing what it says on the tin, it is a Renewable Heat INCENTIVE and is designed to cover the additional capital cost of the installation of a renewable energy source over oil/lpg etc. it pays over 7 years as that is the average length of owenership of a property, RHI payments are transferable to a new owner.

If the 'free' boiler offered is a WES or a Trianco, please note we won't install those. Draw your own conclusions from that.

 

[quality]

I haven't done much with pellet boilers but Ive been installing heat pumps mainly air source but a few ground source (probably 30 ground) for well over ten years without any RHI. Believe me a properly designed system knocks spots of oil and LPG and also beats gas for running costs. the only downside is initial installation cost but only because we have had gas boilers and the gas boiler systems (temperature) as standard for decades.
Many quality heating engineers like most on here have only ever installed gas but there is a massive market for heat pumps. The daikin hybrid I posted about just before Christmas (which got no replies) is possibly the way forward I have done another two since. The people in the industry need to accept that gas is not the only option.
At today's price (complete system) yes gas is the cheapest easiest way to heat any building. I bet I cant say that in 10 years time

 

[gassafe]

Sounds like a lot of manual labour involved for the customer keeping one of these things running lol! Jay the plumber said he has to refill his 65kg hopper every other day when in heating mode!!

Like anything the price of wood pellets will shoot up, plus you gotta have a serious amount of space to store very dry pellets that can't get damp as they swell!

 

[Worcester]

Bear in mind that all these installs will be off gas grid, so tend to be more rural, and with that tends to go the opportunity for storage space.

The cheap / bottom end of the market tend to require more work than the high end units.

The high end units we install require no more input from the user than oil or lpg boilers, just more space, which as above doesn't tend to be an issue.

The lower end tend to be people that are also doing this for environmental reasons and accept that they will need to so something. In those cases it is nearly always less than they are already doing - log burners, anthracite boilers etc.

So compared to your urban cosy gas boiler, yes it's less convenient. Compared to what they have at the moment it's a major leap forward

 

[tickdoc]

Ye its really hard to know but they said they will install and mantain it for free . Thats what got her intrest as her boiler about 18 yrs old.

 

[quality]

nothing is free not in 2016

 

[TVP&H Ltd]

nothing is free not in 2016

This sounds like the free solar panel scam.....

They will install and maintain for free, the house holder feeds it with pellets and the supplier takes all or the larger share of the RHI.

All I can say is read the small print very carefully.

 

[tickdoc]

I think you hit the nail on the head i beleive they plan to take all the rhi payments. Ive saw the letter it doesnt mention the householder getting anything but a free boiler and service.

 

[Worcester]

Well I guess they'll only do that if they can make more money out of the RHI payments than installing the boiler.

See above, I wouldn't recommend anyone thinking this will save them any money short term due to the price of oil, it may well cost her twice as much, and a LOT more inconvenience over the next 3 -4 years.

I also wouldn't recommend a manual fill boiler to anyone over 50 (think what you / they will be like in 10 years time), handling 10-15kg bags and cleaning it out frequently.

This sounds like the free solar panel scam.

Was never actually a scam, just wasn't right for some people. For others it was exactly what they needed.

Same as this. There are only a very few people for whom this is the right solution.
Broke, can't afford anything, broken down boiler, not on benefits, no family to help, reasonably fit and capable of filling and emptying boiler.

Forget it if any mobility issues or potential issues.

If on benefits though (of almost any sort) there may well be some financial support to her getting a new efficient oil boiler - see something like this: Info grant boilers Support by the ECO scheme.

See also:
Government ECO Scheme - Age Concern Liverpool
Affordable Warmth Scheme. BOILER GRANTS available now
https://www.gov.uk/energy-company-obligation

Note some of those links are commercial operators..

 

[Swizz]

If it's a Pellet Boiler with a free install.. I'd personally go for it.
What boiler are they getting?

I have been installing them for a while and like anything they can break, nothing of the un-norm.
Heat wise... Yes you will get the same temp as an oil boiler.
Empty the ash bin once a week (no different than putting your bins out).

Oil is cheap now so leaves people wary, my personal opinion.. Oil will go up much higher than pellets again within the next 10 years.

Most importantly it's doing that little bit for the carbon foot pint.
It's going to be rewarding knowing you wouldn't have the input of destroying earth while heating your home.

 

[Swizz]

They do have a way of self filling the pellets... If your mate can't lift, it's probably worth "ya mate" asking about these guys filling a pellet hose.

and yes of course they are getting the RHI, it's not a scam :/ Remember it's a free install/maintenance? How else would this company run dishing out free installs haha :rofl: