Vokera excell80sp query

[darkwood]

Hi guys... just a heads up first I've popped over from the electrical Forum where I Mod' for a little advice, yep I know, a Sparky asking a Plumber for advice, must be a sign of the end of the world :O
What my issue is my own boiler has been playing up, I'm a Electrical Engineer by trade and build control systems so actually identifying the problem wasn't a issue, burner flame cutout, refusal to ignite etc etc all traced down to the fan that had slowly but surely bit the dust and seized up, anyway after replacing said part it cured all the problems in one swift swoop but a new issue has risen it ugly head - the flame will only work in low thus I get luke warm water and C/H the same..

My query is what the Modulator voltages should be for High and Low as at present I'm only seeing 12v dc with a low flame.. now the way I see this is it thinks its already at temperature with the onboard stat which both are set to full, I'm aware it should start off high flame but it doesn't so suspect the fault on the pcb... any input would be great and please be kind or I'll set Dan on you

PS - I am not interfering with the Gas side and nothing has been changed other than the fan which before its failure the boiler was all working fine.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Sorry to say yes you have, even opening the boiler case you need to be gas safe these days

Fan adjusts how much gas is pulled

 

[Harvest Fields]

As above mate. The case should not have been removed.

 

[rpm]

Offering you a warm welcome darkwood and hoping somebody will pm you soon to offer a fellow tradesman a trade price deal to fix it for you.
Roughly, where are you in the UK?

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Offering you a warm welcome darkwood and hoping somebody will pm you soon to offer a fellow tradesman a trade price deal to fix it for you.
Roughly, where are you in the UK?

West Yorkshire

 

[rpm]

West Yorkshire

Why not let the man speak for himself Shaun.
OK, anybody around that area to help a fellow tradesman out here? Thinking there used to be a stack of members from Yorkshire!

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Why not let the man speak for himself Shaun.
OK, anybody around that area to help a fellow tradesman out here? Thinking there used to be a stack of members from Yorkshire!

Don't think he's posting just watching us he's viewing the thread

I hang my head in shame!!!!!!!

 

[darkwood]

Sorry to say yes you have, even opening the boiler case you need to be gas safe these days

Fan adjusts how much gas is pulled

Yes, I understand where the red tape of limitations apply and I'm aware of these as we ourselves have our own set of standards of which some are overkill, I work in designing machinery control and many of these machines are temping lines and burners and I design the actual control and safety side of these systems so I am no DIYer homeowner with all respect.
Also been on the other forum I realise you cannot be seen to be encouraging such acts so respect your position here, given the actual red tape here which we all know is there just to protect the muppets out there from killing themselves not the technically minded and competent, I am fully aware which parts of the boiler not to get involved with and how other parts effect there workings, in the real world telling an electrical Engineer he cannot remove a cover to connect a stat or the power when he is more qualified to do so than the Gas Engineer himself on that aspect is madness.
I understand the nature of the fan, its duty and the systems thereafter that ensure it is working properly, these are all in working order, the pressure differential valve is a 1 stage unit so this would not allow the burners to fire at all whether it be low or high flame if it hasn't created enough negative pressure to operate the differential valve, it is working as designed to do so hence I get a fire up..

Like I said, I understand you have to play by the book on advice as we do over the other channel but try give a little leeway here, I am sure you can tell I know what I am talking about, the Irony for me is I design some of the control systems your industrial sector connect up yet I need a Gas Safe recognition to change an electrical fan connected to a PCB just because it is housed under the same cover. If you can tell me exactly how what I have could be dangerous given my career here and it is monitored by a 1 stage differential pressure switch then I'll stand corrected.. yes I know I cannot take the cover off by the rule but you must admit sometimes these rules are somewhat overboard to say someone of my knowledge.

 

[darkwood]

Don't think he's posting just watching us he's viewing the thread

I hang my head in shame!!!!!!!

Hope ye all still have a sense of humour like when we last visited when our forum crashed

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Yes agree with you but you've installed a new fan how do you know the gas ratio and mix is right do you have a flue gas analyser etc

It's like asking one of your customers to do an ecir

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Hope ye all still have a sense of humour like when we last visited when our forum crashed

It's all good and still have it somewhere

 

[darkwood]

Yes agree with you but you've installed a new fan how do you know the gas ratio and mix is right do you have a flue gas analyser etc

It's like asking one of your customers to do an ecir

You raise a good point but it will be no different from before the fan went faulty to after the new one was fitted as nothing else has changed, if the gas mix is wrong it was before but in you raising that I will get my neighbour to do a flue gas check and a pressure check on the mains as she owes me a small favour, she is fully carded Gas Engineer.

Also you'll find our trade are nowhere near as strict as yours, we have a DIY section and we advise how to change sockets, lights etc and do make them aware they will not be able to test the circuit given they don't have the equipment, in fact our trade is a joke at the moment because you can go on a 5 week course, come out with a domestic qualification and then wire someones house with no experience
We carefully monitor the DIY section for the advise given and what the member is asking and we do have a line drawn to advice given but where someone can give and show competence we allow a little more help, I was hoping that might be the case here but do realise the Gas Safe body are a little tighter on rules.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

You raise a good point but it will be no different from before the fan went faulty to after the new one was fitted as nothing else has changed, if the gas mix is wrong it was before but in you raising that I will get my neighbour to do a flue gas check and a pressure check on the mains as she owes me a small favour, she is fully carded Gas Engineer.

Also you'll find our trade are nowhere near as strict as yours, we have a DIY section and we advise how to change sockets, lights etc and do make them aware they will not be able to test the circuit given they don't have the equipment, in fact our trade is a joke at the moment because you can go on a 5 week course, come out with a domestic qualification and then wire someones house with no experience
We carefully monitor the DIY section for the advise given and what the member is asking and we do have a line drawn to advice given but where someone can give and show competence we allow a little more help, I was hoping that might be the case here but do realise the Gas Safe body are a little tighter on rules.

Same as us your lights and sockets flip over to us toilets taps cylinders etc

Cover back on run the hot tap does it go to high fire

 

[darkwood]

I got a thread going on our forum, a bit of mocking lol about me coming over here as in the link you posted, noted is a good member of ours who made the very good point that I am doing nothing illegal as the rules of taking of the cover only apply to someone doing work for a customer and do not go so far as a home owner on his own boiler.
The only thing I could get issues with is if my actions blew my house up and the insurance cover was made void.

@ShaunCorbs

The cover is on now
I draw hot water and it come out luke warm with stat up and water pressure good, it is not too high as it is noted boiler only on low flame from fire up it never goes high even on C/H when rads are cold, it stays on low so to me this means either the temp' sensor is faulty or the PCB is buggered? The PCB must think it has reached temp' not to allow full flame.

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Unlikely to be a temp sensor as there normally independent one for heating one for hot water

You can check them if your gas safe should have an ohm reading 10-13k ish but will be listed in the manufacturer instructions

 

[townfanjon]

Somebody mentioned "gods own "

 

[darkwood]

Its looking like the PCB then at 15+ yrs old it probably didn't like been disturbed when the hinged cover is lowered, That's why I queried the voltage, all these manufacturers guides don't go deeper than a flow chart and say replace this or that - I'll see if I can test it out, last time it went I was quoted £200 quid to replace inc' labour, I repaired it for £3.49 and it has lasted 10yrs on that repair, it was the pcb mounted relay had failed, 5 mins to replace it.

PS - Given the understandable caution to answer my query I do appreciate any help that has been given, I think in all honesty that after I get it working this time that I will look to invest in a new condenser boiler ~(fitted by qualified GSE) even I know my limits, sick of replacing the domestic and flow switch diaphragm every 18-24months.. apparently a big flaw of this particular model.

Please feel free to pop over to our Forum with any queries, I think we can break the mold with a little extra help for you guys if you don't mind the odd mockery

 

[darkwood]

Somebody mentioned "gods own "

We have a sense of humour lol... anyway I hear on the grapevine your a closet Leeds United fan who's jumped on the promotion band wagon of Town

 

[townfanjon]

We have a sense of humour lol... anyway I hear on the grapevine your a closet Leeds United fan who's jumped on the promotion band wagon of Town

No , its you who have the sence of humour lol .
I saw us get promoted back in 1970 and have waited patiently ( big LOL ) for it to happen again , I honestly never thought I would . David Wagner is a bloody magician, I love him.

 

[rpm]

We have a sense of humour lol... anyway I hear on the grapevine your a closet Leeds United fan who's jumped on the promotion band wagon of Town

I did warn you not to do that

 

[darkwood]

No , its you who have the sence of humour lol .
I saw us get promoted back in 1970 and have waited patiently ( big LOL ) for it to happen again , I honestly never thought I would . David Wagner is a bloody magician, I love him.

Just mocking, I don't really follow football but my local has both Town and Leeds fans as regulars, I probably don't live that far from you and rpm but Ill not divulge too much off my where abouts as I know you terriers can get a grudge - fun watching my mates though banter on about it from opposite positions.

 

[darkwood]

I did warn you not to do that

What do we all do when we see a wet paint sign - too much of a temptation to sit on that info'

 

[rpm]

Just mocking, I don't really follow football but my local has both Town and Leeds fans as regulars, I probably don't live that far from you and rpm

Hell, I'm around 200 miles away! But will meet tfj one day, maybe next time I visit sis up north

 

[townfanjon]

Just mocking, I don't really follow football but my local has both Town and Leeds fans as regulars, I probably don't live that far from you and rpm but Ill not divulge too much off my where abouts as I know you terriers can get a grudge - fun watching my mates though banter on about it from opposite positions.

Our young fans have a huge problem with Leeds fans , personally they dont bother me , as for Bradford well .......Pffftttt.

I havnt read all the posts but a word of advice , put a new boiler in pal . Thats ones well past its sell buy date .

 

[townfanjon]

Hell, I'm around 200 miles away! But will meet tfj one day, maybe next time I visit sis up north

You seem to be quiet these days pal , have you got over us beating Reading lol

 

[rpm]

You seem to be quiet these days pal , have you got over us beating Reading lol

On penalties! You forgot on penalties
Been quiet coz this place is like tumbleweed nowadays for the craic as well you know my friend.

 

[darkwood]

Sorted -

Got my neighbour round with her meter GSE compliant, it turns out that my main Gas isolation lever actually restricts gas flow if fully opened for some reason pull it back a few degrees solved this ...
I closed the lever before removing the cover then when done I opened it back up not realising it mustn't have been fully over by a fraction.

Cheers for the banter, I know I ruffled a few feathers and brought a little exitement into your forum

 

[ShaunCorbs]

Hahaha least it was something simple

 

[townfanjon]

Sorted -

Got my neighbour round with her meter GSE compliant, it turns out that my main Gas isolation lever actually restricts gas flow if fully opened for some reason pull it back a few degrees solved this .
I closed the lever before removing the cover then when done I opened it back up not realising it mustn't have been fully over by a fraction.

Cheers for the banter, I know I ruffled a few feathers and brought a little exitement into your forum

 

[townfanjon]

Lady gas person round here ... Vicky maybe

 

[Harvest Fields]

Don't think that the problem was helping you out mate. I thought the rules on here was that we cannot discuss gas issues to people on here through on open forum? Did I miss something?

 

[darkwood]

Don't think that the problem was helping you out mate. I thought the rules on here was that we cannot discuss gas issues to people on here through on open forum? Did I miss something?

With all respect we have similar rules our side too, but the admin and mods including myself will take it on a case by case value and not slap a one fits all rule on it, I dare say your own Mods and Admin will share the same approach but if you disagree please feel free to report my thread and get a second opinion, I ask you, given my profession and the fact I design some of the equipment your trade connects to, do you seriously think that preaching GS rules that don't apply to me working on my own boiler in my own property somehow means I cannot take the cover off for a routine electrical issue and replacement of the part?

 

[Harvest Fields]

With all respect we have similar rules our side too, but the admin and mods including myself will take it on a case by case value and not slap a one fits all rule on it, I dare say your own Mods and Admin will share the same approach but if you disagree please feel free to report my thread and get a second opinion, I ask you, given my profession and the fact I design some of the equipment your trade connects to, do you seriously think that preaching GS rules that don't apply to me working on my own boiler in my own property somehow means I cannot take the cover off for a routine electrical issue and replacement of the part?

I do not and will not get into a heated arguement with you mate. I may be new to this but if I had commented on your question, then I would have been told off for it. Please look at my link below.
https://www.User PlumbersForums.net...legally-work-on-a-gas-appliance-factsheet.pdf
If they do not work please let me know and I will post pictures of the pages. If you wanted an answer from a MOD then surely you should have messaged one of them directly and not posted it onto an open forum and as you mentioned above for clarity to myself please can I ask @Lou or @Dan to either please explain how I am wrong on this matter or can one of the Gas Safe MODS from this forum explain please. As far as I am concerned the fan is inside the combustion cover which my link covers? And the rules still apply.

 

[Lou]

Hi guys

Unfortunately this thread needs moving to gsr forum.

I am closing it now too.

Thanks