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Hi and thanks for the replies, the qualifications i'll be working towards are; nvq l2 city & guilds 6189 plumbing, BPEC and city & guilds 2399 part p (defined scope) domestic electrical qualification and then there are other 'domestic renewable energy engineer' modules incorporating harvested & graywater, air & ground source pumps, solar thermal hot water systems that i believe are 'mcs' qualifications.
I kind of like the way that this coarse works studying from home, it suits me personally, i can see how others are against it but each to their own opinion. My main concern is the qualifications, if i wanted to just do plumbing could i? I know that i can't do any gas and i plan to incorporate that at a later date. Again any help is very much appreciated
 
From what I understand, you could do so as a self employed plumber, but most companies would reject those kinds of qualifications.
That's why I'm looking the way of evening courses at a local college; the qualifications would be similar, if not identical to those they offer, but MUCH cheaper.
As for the software they use, I think a good search online would produce similar, if not better programs.
Gaisa
 
Anyone else got an opinion, I'd love to hear from someone who has finished the coarse. And why would an employer reject industry recognised qualifications?
 
why would an employer reject industry recognised qualifications?

I am an employer. I loose track of C&G numbers and to tell you the truth i am not interested in them. C&G are a recognised certification body but they have split the quals up so much to offer meaningless foot in the door certificates that they are meaningless to me.
The only qual i require is (S)(N)VQ3 with a full apprenticeship and cv of prior experience. Anything else is irrelevant to me and i am not alone in my thinking.
Hence when you do a fast track you will struggle severely to be employed.
I'm just being honest but do what you feel is right for you.
 
Its not the qualifications, so much as the experience; those who use such courses aren't held in as high a regard as those who went through the full college course and apprenticeships. That's why its easier for those who take the courses and college courses you and I are looking at, tend to go into self employed vocations, but be warned, the rep lied about the shortages, yes, plumbers are always needed, but its nowhere near as great as they claim.
 
I am an employer. I loose track of C&G numbers and to tell you the truth i am not interested in them. C&G are a recognised certification body but they have split the quals up so much to offer meaningless foot in the door certificates that they are meaningless to me.
The only qual i require is (S)(N)VQ3 with a full apprenticeship and cv of prior experience. Anything else is irrelevant to me and i am not alone in my thinking.
Hence when you do a fast track you will struggle severely to be employed.
I'm just being honest but do what you feel is right for you.

I appreciate what you're saying, but how does a 30+ male with a wife, 2 kids and a mortgage give up his job and take an apprenticeship, this isn't realistic. The coarse provider has promised me a placement to get on site experience and sign off coarse modules. There are training workshops where i have to show my competancy and the coarse i'm taking is designed to run between 2-3 years, so naturally i'm sat here scratching my head trying to understand why the coarse i'm about to embark upon has been labeled 'fasttrack'?
To be honest if the truth is known i think many plumbers frown upon these coarses because middle aged men with a drive to succeed are retraining and entering there trade, i appreciate that there will be some muppets slip through the net, but why would i put myself through this and not want to make a go of it? It shouldn't be so cut and dry when it comes to employment no one will have a chance.
 
Hi and thanks for the replies, the qualifications i'll be working towards are; nvq l2 city & guilds 6189 plumbing, BPEC and city & guilds 2399 part p


working towards? Makes it sound like they only offering part of the quals?
 
hi jerrytheberry
im in exactly the same boat as you I have a partner and 2 kids and want to retrain as a plumber so I can work for myself and possibly further my education once Im experienced. I have just signed up to the t4ts level 2/3 plumbing and heating course which i hope to complete in 2/3 years i understand to get these qualifications (nvq 2/3) you need to build up an onsite portfolio which I have no problem with as I believe this to be the key to a successful plumber. T4ts rep said to me that they will place you in employment to gain your level 2 but level 3 they could nt promise but would try this is also stated in writting. i do believe there are potential problems with doing it this way but as long as your working towards the right qualifications nothing in this world is going to land on your lap just because you spent 5,750 on a course but if it puts you in with a real chance of working in that proffession and gives you key skills and knowledge along the way then why not.
There are a few things im worried about tho like will I get a tutor assigned to me in 21 days or will i have to chase him, also wether the practical dates will fit in with my schedule as I work as van converter.
It would be interesting to hear of your progress and if you have tutor worries maybe as we are starting at similar times we could keep up to date on things. let me no and good luck
one other thing evening classes are good but if your not employed as a plumbers mate it is almost impossible to get onto especially where i live so it seems t4ts is my only option
 
To be honest if the truth is known i think many plumbers frown upon these coarses because middle aged men with a drive to succeed are retraining and entering there trade, i appreciate that there will be some muppets slip through the net, but why would i put myself through this and not want to make a go of it? It shouldn't be so cut and dry when it comes to employment no one will have a chance.

When it comes to employment, the difference between someone who has done a course (fastrack or spun out over however many years) and someone who has followed a recognised apprenticeship route is experience. This experience is passed on by other tradesmen over a period of years.
Giving people chances costs money and customers. No employer in any line of work will normally take on someone who cannot do the job they are employed to do and loose customers by sending incompetent people to do it. Remember most plumbers will be working on their own most of the time with no one there to help when things go wrong so you are expected to know how to deal with any situation you will find.
Only an exceptional few, no matter how much drive or commitment most may have, could do this and take up an employed position where you would be expected to be sent to and deal with any aspect of the trade. Classroom scenarios and even worse computer based ones, are nothing like real life.

There are proper employed adult trainees within the industry, employed in a similar way to apprentices (albeit on a higher pay rate) gaining on the job experience over 2-3 years. Unfortunately there are few being taken on as the work load at the moment does not require it.
The experience gained from the so called placements offered by training centres is limited and tailored to get you past the bare minimum requirements. The theory side of things is the easy bit and can be learned by anyone with a half a brain. Actually knowing how to do the job or having the practical skills to do so is not something taught in a classroom. Having done an apprenticeship shows your perspective employer you have been done the industry recognised route of qualification and training and have gained experience in doing so.

By all means retrain and do this but do not expect to be able to be employable for a long time after it unless you fall into the exceptional category in both skills and luck.
You will probably have to go self employed and do your real learning at your own and your customers expense.
 
When it comes to employment, the difference between someone who has done a course (fastrack or spun out over however many years) and someone who has followed a recognised apprenticeship route is experience. This experience is passed on by other tradesmen over a period of years.
Giving people chances costs money and customers. No employer in any line of work will normally take on someone who cannot do the job they are employed to do and loose customers by sending incompetent people to do it. Remember most plumbers will be working on their own most of the time with no one there to help when things go wrong so you are expected to know how to deal with any situation you will find.
Only an exceptional few, no matter how much drive or commitment most may have, could do this and take up an employed position where you would be expected to be sent to and deal with any aspect of the trade. Classroom scenarios and even worse computer based ones, are nothing like real life.

There are proper employed adult trainees within the industry, employed in a similar way to apprentices (albeit on a higher pay rate) gaining on the job experience over 2-3 years. Unfortunately there are few being taken on as the work load at the moment does not require it.
The experience gained from the so called placements offered by training centres is limited and tailored to get you past the bare minimum requirements. The theory side of things is the easy bit and can be learned by anyone with a half a brain. Actually knowing how to do the job or having the practical skills to do so is not something taught in a classroom. Having done an apprenticeship shows your perspective employer you have been done the industry recognised route of qualification and training and have gained experience in doing so.

By all means retrain and do this but do not expect to be able to be employable for a long time after it unless you fall into the exceptional category in both skills and luck.
You will probably have to go self employed and do your real learning at your own and your customers expense.

Thanks for your view on it, i respect that. You've opened my eyes a little and i've got a pretty good idea which way i'm going to go with this.
 
hi jerrytheberry
im in exactly the same boat as you I have a partner and 2 kids and want to retrain as a plumber so I can work for myself and possibly further my education once Im experienced. I have just signed up to the t4ts level 2/3 plumbing and heating course which i hope to complete in 2/3 years i understand to get these qualifications (nvq 2/3) you need to build up an onsite portfolio which I have no problem with as I believe this to be the key to a successful plumber. T4ts rep said to me that they will place you in employment to gain your level 2 but level 3 they could nt promise but would try this is also stated in writting. i do believe there are potential problems with doing it this way but as long as your working towards the right qualifications nothing in this world is going to land on your lap just because you spent 5,750 on a course but if it puts you in with a real chance of working in that proffession and gives you key skills and knowledge along the way then why not.
There are a few things im worried about tho like will I get a tutor assigned to me in 21 days or will i have to chase him, also wether the practical dates will fit in with my schedule as I work as van converter.
It would be interesting to hear of your progress and if you have tutor worries maybe as we are starting at similar times we could keep up to date on things. let me no and good luck
one other thing evening classes are good but if your not employed as a plumbers mate it is almost impossible to get onto especially where i live so it seems t4ts is my only option

Nice to hear from you, i'm not too concerned about the tutor i'm sure they'll be in touch in due coarse. It would be interesting to hear how you get on though.
 
Read the Older posts T4TS have many names Train 2 game skills train etc the list goes on Jan tellinsky is behind them all. They even go as far to quote themselves as being a certified cisco systems partner yet, when asked Cisco had never heard of them. They rip people off - no getting away from that!
Dont tell me the salesman came in showed you a DVD on the course. gives you some fancy booklets told you how good the course is and how it could transform your finances. Then he makes you do an aptitude test. whilst doing that he'll ring "his office" Then says that he'll arrange payment to your course.
Then you get your paperwork through the post with a credit/loan agreement from a bank saying that the course fee has been paid in full. Yet you have to make over 13 payments before they allow you to attend the practical. Yet you have a piece of paper in your hand saying that the course has been payed for by the loan company. Surely if the course has been paid, then what is the issue on how soon youn attend the practical?
Get on that phone and cancel as soon as poss or else they set the credit information bureau on you - Google them and they look like a big frightening company - google the post code and you find a house in a small housing estate. I got stung for over a grand before I wised up to them and dont want anyone else to go through the same as me.
BBC watchdog, BBC Rogue traders, Trading standards, and consumer direct have a list as long as your on on T4TS so Stay well away and go to your local college - it may not have the flexible times of T4TS but gives real qualifications and gives no false illusions of what you will get from them.
 
to be honest mate i recieve my work all the time i normally get back my assigned assesmetn every week, dont read these threads, i just done my week 1 and 2 and someone failed the wate regs, he just quit because he failed on exam, to be honest mate do it and dont quit
 
to be honest mate i recieve my work all the time i normally get back my assigned assesmetn every week, dont read these threads, i just done my week 1 and 2 and someone failed the wate regs, he just quit because he failed on exam, to be honest mate do it and dont quit

Thanks for a positive point of view. I've now started the coarse, done the first module and started the second, i couldn't find a reason not to do it. Wether its a little over priced or not i don't know, but the coarse suits my personal circumstances and thats all i can say at the moment. I'll post my findings as i go through the coarse, and thankyou all for any points of view you've offered.
 
Hello everybody

I am currently working towards my Technical Certificate in Basic Plumbing Studies 6129 Level 2. I wanted to know how much money does it cost to achieve the NVQ Level 2 (which will qualify my as a domestic plumber). Secondly, when I am doing my training with Train 4 Trade Skills will I have to travel to RF Training Centre, Manchester every day to achieve the NVQ Level 2 with a Qualify Plumber or will the plumber come to my house? Finally, Why is it that is it important to achieve functional/key skills in both maths and english whereas at a training centre it is not required?

Thank you :)
 
Hi, just to say that i had a call from T4TS this morning, after failing the 4 online H&S Pre attendance tests then failing first attempt at the paper test, i have been told that i have now passed at long last. now got to wait for letter in post saying when i can go in and do practical. will keep you all updated as events unfold. my message is don't give up on the H&S test!
 
I've been watching the posts here ever since I signed up for the plumbing course some 3 years ago on the understanding that the qualification I would get would be for Part P electrical, plumbing and most importantly for me as a timed served plumber Gas Safe registration. That was what the guy who sold me the course told me. For various reasons (marriage breakup & illness) I was unable to take the course at the time. I was told there was no chance of a refund, not wanting to wreck my credit rating I have continued to pay for the course out of my now almost non existent savings. I am now able to do the course and rang T4Ts to get started, whilst I was on the phone I asked whether the change from Corgi to Gas Safe would materially affect the course, the tutor was most surprised as my course never included anything except "Gas Safety"? (I thought the rules were clear "no gas safe qualification, no touching gas installations"?) At this point I called my local Trading Standards, they came to my house, took a statement and all the course materials (giving me a very detailed receipt for everything) and informed me that T4Ts was under investigation, having received a mountain of complaints, so watch this space.... One thing the trading standards guy did say though was not to expect to get my money back and also that T4Ts had taken on and won a case against Google to get them not to show sites criticising them.
 
i dont know how they offer this. i suspect they chose theeir words carefully and they dont actually say you will get this but a phrase i often here is 'it will lead to ......'
there are lots of warnings on here about what you can get for what and from who, but late now but always do your homework
 
Ive just had my first attempt at the pre-attendance test and failed. Annoying when you dont even get an idea of percentages. There are a couple of questions im dubious about at the options given dont seem to apply to any of the statements.

Has anyone actually passed it? Two huge PDF files with supposedly all you need and I still fail. What hope have I got?
 
Sorry mate...no chance... I have never failed a test in my life (inc a degree) until this...I took photos of the questions on my third attempt and started showing other site managers ...they all said it was ridiculous especially when you have a choice of answers like both statements are correct and both are correct in the same question...sorry again but it is hopeless...I have yet to find anyone who has passed...basicallly this is a 4 week designed delay until giving you the paper test which took me around 40 hours to complete as it is a 80 page dissitation with more rules about plagarism than NASA..............I am now waiting for the results......but chin up as at least you know that everyone in weeks 3&4 have all been through the nonsense and know heaps about H&S...
 
hi im just about to start this course but it aint c&g 6129 its c&g 6189 what is it is it the same
 
Hello Bobby

I have completed my C&G 6129 Technical Certificate in Basic Plumbing Studies Level 2. I will be progressing onto C&G NVQ Diploma in Plumbing & Domestic Heating Level 3 full-time 1 year. Yes, it is replacing the old 6129 Technical Certificate - It is a much better qualification and is the new one for those who want to either become a qualified plumber completing NVQ Level 2 & 6189 Diploma Level 2 or even Level 3 which will be more complex gas system etc.. to become Gas Safe Registered Plumber.

Hope this helps
 
hi im just starting this course bit its not city&guilds 6129 its 6189 is it the same and it says i will end with a nvq level 3 after 3 years is this true
 
hi mohammed

did you do this course with training 4 trades atl if so how did you feel about the and are they any good
Hello Bobby

I have completed my C&G 6129 Technical Certificate in Basic Plumbing Studies Level 2. I will be progressing onto C&G NVQ Diploma in Plumbing & Domestic Heating Level 3 full-time 1 year. Yes, it is replacing the old 6129 Technical Certificate - It is a much better qualification and is the new one for those who want to either become a qualified plumber completing NVQ Level 2 & 6189 Diploma Level 2 or even Level 3 which will be more complex gas system etc.. to become Gas Safe Registered Plumber.

Hope this helps
 
Hi there

I was wondering if there is any1 on that would be able to help me as i have just past the aptitude test and really want to go for this?
But ive been reading over the forum and its really negative comments is there any1 with good feedback? and who has had good time with ATL training 4 trades? thanks mohammed for your comments would love to hear about how you have been getting on and how you think the course is
 
Hello mate,

No I haven't done my C&G 6129 Technical Certificates Level 2. I have achieve it at The Oldham College 1 year. Yes you will end up with 6189 certificate. But to do the NVQ you will have to be working with a qualified plumber.
 
Hi mate

Thanks for the help the guy i was speaking 2 says they would get me a placement but i would need 2 work for free?? is this true and why did you not tick with training for trades??? did you have trouble with them ???
 
Hello again,

I honestly don't have a any idea about working free :/ Also I never went to Train 4 Trade Skills. I honstly don't believe that they will allow you to work towards your NVQ for free (I've phoned many training centres and they cost money £2,000) I would definetly pay an employer to take you on as an apprentice if you can). Anway, how much money are you paying to achieve the C&G 6189 Diploma in Plumbing & Domestic Heating Level 2 or 3.
 
Hello again,

I honestly don't have a any idea about working free :/ Also I never went to Train 4 Trade Skills. I honstly don't believe that they will allow you to work towards your NVQ for free (I've phoned many training centres and they cost money £2,000) I would definetly pay an employer to take you on as an apprentice if you can). Anway, how much money are you paying to achieve the C&G 6189 Diploma in Plumbing & Domestic Heating Level 2 or 3.



Hi mohammed


I am paying a contribution fee of £32 pounds a week over 3 years? but they also say that the get private funding of £5600 for any 1 that complets the course and doesn't drop out after they get they're level 2,??? But i also have to pay £100 pounds up front for to regester withC&G??? i'm a little but iffy of the course as i dont want to spend all that money and not get the full diploma at the finish!!! Do you have any advice? thanks again
 
Hi

It all depends on your age, how old are you ?

The only advice which I can give you is to do what I am going to do. I don't believe in training centers, to be a good plumber 1/2 years working alone side an experience plumber is required. If your going to spend money like that, why don't you look for a self-employer plumber and pay him, but don't tell the college.

This is what I am doing within the next one or two years:

I have already completed my C&G 6129 Basic Plumbing Studies Level 2, I am in the process of waiting to start my C&G 6189 Diploma in Plumbing & Domestic Heating Level 3. Whiles I am working towards my Level 3, I'm hoping by September I have a car - I am going to registered with TomKat Gas Training which provide the NVQ's Level 2 first & then Level 3 (ACS Gas Accreditation). Yes this is a training center, but one which they are not after money, their aim is to get you qualified Gas Safe registered plumber which should take two years on site.
 
Hi

It all depends on your age, how old are you ?

The only advice which I can give you is to do what I am going to do. I don't believe in training centers, to be a good plumber 1/2 years working alone side an experience plumber is required. If your going to spend money like that, why don't you look for a self-employer plumber and pay him, but don't tell the college.

This is what I am doing within the next one or two years:

I have already completed my C&G 6129 Basic Plumbing Studies Level 2, I am in the process of waiting to start my C&G 6189 Diploma in Plumbing & Domestic Heating Level 3. Whiles I am working towards my Level 3, I'm hoping by September I have a car - I am going to registered with TomKat Gas Training which provide the NVQ's Level 2 first & then Level 3 (ACS Gas Accreditation). Yes this is a training center, but one which they are not after money, their aim is to get you qualified Gas Safe registered plumber which should take two years on site.

Hi again


I'm 29, do you have to do the the C&G 6129 before you go forward and go for the C&G 6189? i thought you done the C&G 6189 level 2&3. I think I'm going to try the college route myself, There are to many if's and buts about the ATL train 4trade!!! So after you do your first year at college do you need a work placement to get your full C&G 6189level 2, as i was told you only get SVQ's from the college??
 
I am looking into a quick course including T4TS and I am reading a lot of negativity of these type of courses (across several threads) and there is no doubt that they are not equal to an apprenticeship that lasts several years but not everybody can get an apprenticeship or into a local college and therefore these are a real alternative to allow people to get their foot into the door. I think it is easy for people to criticise but sometimes people have no other choice if they want a career as a plumber. I live in London and I can tell you that whenever I need a plumber they charge a small fortune... up to £500 per day and therefore the more people we can get in this industry to increase competition, pull down the price, and improve the customer service skills for the consumer the better!
 
i agree mate im doing the t4ts course and it great the only let down i find is waiting for the modules to be marked but apart from that it in depth and going on my first 2 week practical on 24th september
 
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