Discuss ROCA rant - perhaps their factories are a Masonic secret :) ??? in the Plumbing Jobs | The Job-board area at PlumbersForums.net

Status
Not open for further replies.

Ric2013

Plumbers Arms member
Plumber
Messages
3,910
A customer wants to know country of origin for baths I have quoted on.

Email correspondence with Roca has been interesting.

Roca first told me '[t]hey are made in one of our Roca factory'. Customer and I had a laugh about that, saying we were glad they weren't made in a village with each person making one bath each, some being better than others.

I asked Roca where its factories are and I was told '[w]e have factories located all over the world, although [the] majority of our baths are supplied from Spain'.

I asked Roca where the two specific models I was quoting on were made and received a very strange reply '[p]lease can you confirm why you wish to know this information?'

Do you think Roca is concerned I might decide to break into a Roca factory to steal baths and so I need to know which factory I need to go to for the specific model? Bah!
 
A bit rude of them to be so vague and then not answer the specific question of where those models of bath are made.
When they asked - "Can you confirm why you wish to know this information?"
I would reply - Can you confirm why you are not giving this information?
 
I gave them a full and frank reply which managed to be polite, while including such gems as:

...since you have been evading my original question with the tenacity of Michael Howard being interviewed by Jeremy Paxman

They since have let me know that the baths in question would come from one of their factories in Europe. Whether that means EU or just somewhere in Europe, I have no idea. Good way of ensuring I won't be quoting on ROCA again.
 
Does it really matter as long as the items arnt damaged??
 
If you're happy not knowing where your kit comes from, by whom it was made, and what the working conditions/environmental standards were like, then it doesn't. According to a friend of mine, Marx defined this 'object fetishism', when we want an object and aren't interested in what went into making it.

I suppose it would be like getting your plumbing done by illegal immigrants, provided they did a good job.

But my customer cared about that and wanted to know where the bath might come from. Actually, so do I, and I do try to buy as local as possible when I can. In practice, it would be more useful if our government were to legislate to protect people, but this isn't done, so sometimes it is easier to simply ask where something was made.

For reference, I had also priced on a Kaldewei alternative and my question to Kaldewei was answered immediately, Germany. I was even told what town the factory is in.
 
What are the working conditions like,
what qualification does each worker have and does each person stamp there name on there bath

Ask them this and see what response you get

These days you unless it special ordered nothing is made in the uk
 
Don't give a monkeys where stuff comes from as long as it does what it says on the tin.
 
If nobody cared, then there wouldn't be a market for Fairtrade. Also, the fact that some companies are happy to write 'Made in UK' all over their products, Polypipe being one of them, and Kaldewei are very proud of their made in Germany status suggests that they feel it is a selling point. So I don't agree that no one wants to know. I would note that Germany has better union rights than the UK (and probably better working conditions) so I would happily buy German.

All I fail to understand is why Roca has had to be so evasive. A simple answer would have been to say that it is impossible to say with certainty where any particular product is made as they have parallel productions runs in various countries but that all the factories producing baths are in Europe. Had they said this, I'd have simply told the customer the baths were European made, and left it at that.

Shaun: I greatly respect your experience as a plumber and the fact that you are happy to share your knowledge and give sensible advice on this forum. Sarcasm, however, does not suit you and I all I ask is that you accept my right to hold political opinions that you don't agree with, as I am happy to do for you. In fairness I was a bit harsh with you, though, so perhaps it's tit for tat :)
 
There is kit made in the UK but much is labelled as such but is only packed here. This is legally kosher as packing is considered 'a significant element of its manufacture'.

Many items are made in china for european companies as joint ventures. Perhaps, only perhaps, that may be your answer...

In terms of buying locally etc, I happen to agree. If all we ever do is buy on price then we consign ourselves to never having any industry. People are willing to spend, to pay as much as 10% more for British & proper European kit and that's why we manufacture here.
 
There is kit made in the UK but much is labelled as such but is only packed here. This is legally kosher as packing is considered 'a significant element of its manufacture'.

And this is where you would hope our government would step in and ensure its subjects are able to make informed decisions. Depending on your political viewpoint, I suppose.
 
Ric the eternal optimist...
Frankly if they cant see Brexit for being the complete 'crock' it is, then what hope anything else of even lesser substance.
 
Well, if we Brexit, we might need to do anything we can to encourage home industry :)

It wasn't that many years ago that nearly all sanitary ware and also taps, etc, were UK made. Now nearly everything is made elsewhere, but some with a British brand.
Very sad and our economy would have a massive growth if we all could buy from local manufacturers, but difficult to find many left.
 
Your country is in the same boat you sent us here on.

Why would a company pay someone 100 units a day onshore to do the same job and produce an item, when it could pay a third world employee offshore 2 units a day to produce the same item.

Our Governments must have worked out that they make more money off taxes on imported goods than they pay out in Welfare - otherwise they wouldn't stand for it.
 
Was chatting to a semi-retired precision engineer friend/customer the other day and he mentioned that has memories of helping to polish the taphead moulds for his father who was making the moulds for the Barking Brassware Company. He has the very model of tap in his own bathroom (his wife hates the design - they seem to be 'Crystal' Cross top - but they still look as new, and work) that he helped made the moulds for. So I can now say that I have carried out a plumbing job for someone who received a part of his livelihood from the manufacture of plumbing components. I wonder where the Pegler isolation valve I installed in his house was manufactured?
 
Strange as it may seem, I'm pretty sure Pegler still make valves etc in Doncaster. They used to do taps but now they're made in China like everyone elses (with a couple of notable suggestions but even they still get their cartridges from China).

Many people think this is about shareholder greed. Make no mistake, its actually about the banker parasites who operate in the middle. They don't give a fig where or how they 'earn' their money and will sell their aged aunts if it makes a profit. Unfortunately shareholders do not generally care either so by filling their coffers the pair end up biting the very hand that feeds them...

Welcome to 21st century capitalism ...
 
I would imagine Pegler does still have some level of production over here, going by the fact that the company spent a considerable sum on its Yorkshire plant not that long ago. What I don't know is what is and what isn't.

Don't get me started on neoliberal capitalism... :)
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Reply to ROCA rant - perhaps their factories are a Masonic secret :) ??? in the Plumbing Jobs | The Job-board area at PlumbersForums.net

Creating content since 2001. Untold Media.
Back
Top