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Discuss Protect new power shower from scale? in the Bathrooms, Showers and Wetrooms area at UKPlumbersForums.co.uk.

  1. Jennie

    Jennie GSR

    Hi all,
    I'm due to install a power shower, in a hard water area.
    Currently, the property has a 'Water Elf' electronic water conditioner on the cold mains by the stoptap.
    The home owner would like a water softener fitted. The only place it could go is in the kitchen cupboard by the stoptap (access to the cold water pipes and to run the overflow and drain connections will be a bit of a pain, but not impossible.)
    So...
    Is the water softener the most advisable solution? Or will the Water Elf (or a different magnetic treater) suffice?
    Thanks for all your advice,
    Jennie
     
  2. Matchless.plumb

    Matchless.plumb Trusted Plumber Top Contributor!!

    Hi Jennie,

    Me personally,I asked those questions recently too and the engineers would rather install a softener than an inline scale reducer. These scale reducers use the principle of electrolytic action to alter the characteristics of hard water. Lime scale will just pass through a domestic system without sticking to the heat exchanger but I wouldn't really say they work 100%.

    You are better off installing a softener. I have recently installed the one from Harvey. Excellent piece of kit. Perhaps you could use a condensate pump in case you don't have a waste near by.
     
  3. rpm

    rpm Trusted Plumber Top Contributor!!

    I`ve yet to hear good things of one of those inline magnet things, also some boiler manufactures say No to softened water going through them so bear that in mind.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  4. Matchless.plumb

    Matchless.plumb Trusted Plumber Top Contributor!!

    That's true I had to make sure before hand if the Harvey unit is compatible with the boiler etc.

    The unit is compatible with all type of boilers and it's drinkable too unless you are on a low sodium diet or you've got a new born baby under the age of 6months old. If you want you could bypass the boiler or have a separate hard water link.
     
  5. Jennie

    Jennie GSR

    That Harvey unit sounds interesting. The property has an old, Baxi floor-standing boiler.
     
  6. rpm

    rpm Trusted Plumber Top Contributor!!

    Was under the impression that the kitchen tap had to bypass the softener, stand to be corrected by more experienced people though.
     
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  7. ShaunCorbs

    ShaunCorbs S. Mod Trusted Plumber GSR Top Contributor!!

    Yep your right rpm, Ron I've told you a week ago kitchen tap and an outside tap needs to be unsoft

    And the boiler rule only comes into play if it's a combi or sealed system

    Which the ops isnt
     
  8. rpm

    rpm Trusted Plumber Top Contributor!!

  9. Matchless.plumb

    Matchless.plumb Trusted Plumber Top Contributor!!

    I have split that off but there is no regulation to have a separate hard water pipe to the kitchen tap or garden tap. I have spoken to Harvey and got that all on email, however I have not installed the whole house under the softener but it would work and it wouldn't break any water regulations. If you are unsure @ShaunCorbs@ShaunCorbs you could speak to Harvey direct.

    And yes I have listened to you and installed it only to the rest of the house.

    Is a Drinking Water Tap a Legal Requirement? | Harvey
     
  10. ShaunCorbs

    ShaunCorbs S. Mod Trusted Plumber GSR Top Contributor!!

    Yes there is read your water regs book
     
  11. Matchless.plumb

    Matchless.plumb Trusted Plumber Top Contributor!!

    So, it means Harvey would give false information and a false statement at their page ? Don't you think they should know if that would break the water regs or not that's definitely their job to know
     
  12. ShaunCorbs

    ShaunCorbs S. Mod Trusted Plumber GSR Top Contributor!!

    It will be listed in there book install to bs6700 etc and make sure it's installed by a qualified person

    Passes the blame on
     
  13. Matchless.plumb

    Matchless.plumb Trusted Plumber Top Contributor!!

    For me it's a false statement given by their installer teams
     
  14. rpm

    rpm Trusted Plumber Top Contributor!!

    Think you mean their sales team Ron, it is always the same game being played by manufactures "If all else fails blame the installer", I also noted something about not recommended in that link.
     
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  15. Ric2013

    Ric2013 Plumber Top Contributor!!

    Water Regs book classes softened water as category 2 and states that cat 2 water 'is considered to present no human health hazard'. But common sense would dictate that a drinking tap has to be suitable for EVERYONE, not have excluded people lists. Also, page 10.5 makes it clear that drinking water from a softened source could become unwholesome if not properly maintained, and that proper maintenance may not always take place in domestic environment, so a separate feed is recommended.
     
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    • Agree Agree x 1
  16. king of pipes

    king of pipes Trusted Plumber GSR Top Contributor!!

    Guys this is not helping Jennie with the original post it was asked the best way to protect a new power shower. ? my input is ideally fit a salt water softner with a seperate raw water supply for drinking at the kitchen tap. If that is not possible then fit one of the many water conditioners on the market. Regards kop
     
  17. Ric2013

    Ric2013 Plumber Top Contributor!!

    Fair point KOP. I hadn't added anything different because I thought the suggestion as you have just put it is spot on, provided the customer wants to pay for a water softener.

    If customer doesn't want to spend that much, what are people's thoughts on polyphosphate dispensers, perhaps just on the shower feeds, and are they better than the electrolytic or magnetic types?
     
  18. king of pipes

    king of pipes Trusted Plumber GSR Top Contributor!!

    They do the job bud but not really what i would fit can be a bit messy in the container with the polyphoshate in needs regular maintenance. Kop
     
  19. Jennie

    Jennie GSR

    Thanks everyone for all your advice. It's such a great help - I can now advise my customer better. :)
     
    • Like Like x 1
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