New member needs advice

[PRplumb82]

Hi,

im new to this forum so pleasd to meet u all, i always think its good to have other people in the trade that you can turn to for advice if needed...so nice one in advance for any help you throw my way !!

Basically been plumbing for 5 yrs first couple of yrs as plumbers mate, then my boss decided to put me out on my own fitting boilers, bathroom suites which ive been doing ever since up until last 2 months ..

i have just recently completed my ACS after completing 4 yrs at college in evenings
but it was very hard especially after working 10hr days) but managed to drag myself through and have just applyed to get on gas safe reg..

Thing is i have just recently moved companies to a firm that fits reniewable technologies and i am not really doing much domestic plumbing or heating anymore which i am really starting to miss especially heating, im mainly fitting soloar pv, solor thermal at mo, as a company we do fit heat pumps but i wont get a look in fiiting those coz im new there and theres other lads ahead of me in cue to fit those, plus the heat pumps we install use f-gas (refridgerent gas) which i have no experience of, so so far its mainly fitting the solar panels for me...

spose what im trying to get at is dunno if im making the right desision in going down the reniewables route, its taken me 4 yrs to get gas safe reg'd and get my skills on the domestic p&h up to a good standard..and now im not doin any gas work ect..the thing that i keep telling myself though is reniewables is a rapidly growing market place so ive got to be onto a winner??

my boss said to me in my interview im joining a growing trade not a dieing trade (gas)...im really not sure what 2 do??

Any advice just to see if im making the right desision would be much appreciated!!

Nice one cheers.

 

[Blackcatgas]

Id go with the renewables, get as much exp as you can while you can, your getting a head start on me, I think that gas will still be a part of our energy needs for the considerable future though, past my retirement at least (30years).

 

[PRplumb82]

cheers for the advice mate. Didnt really fancy speaking to any of the lads at work bout it, am just a little worried i am making the wrong decision...top man cheers for feedback

 

[CES]

Stick with renewables mate. We may not like it but the industry is heading in that direction and you dont want to get left behind.

 

[SimonG]

Welcome along, I'd follow the consenus, it may be not what you are wanting to do at the moment but its all about adding strings to your bow. I don't think gaining experience in renewables is a bad thing and you've always got the gas as a fall back.

 

[AWheating]

The way id look at it is if/when you decide to work for yourself in the future the more services you can offer your customers the more work you can go for. While you are in this job push to have them put through as many qualifications as you can.

 

[PlumbBobBob]

sorry to be devils advocate but have you been fitting boilers without being gas safe?

 

[PRplumb82]

cheers for the feed back lads much appreciated, its tricky when my head is pulling me one way and what i love doing is pulling me the other, think im defo gonna stick with reniewables now tho until i get right up to speed with all the technologies then assess my situation again then, il leave the plumbing and heating to the weekends, my own jobs like..

steveb - yes i have been fitting boilers without being gas safe, however i have always had a gas safe eng on site to supervise the work i have done and to sign the jobs off, which as i understand is acceptable and legal, that dont matter anymore now tho coz as soon as my acs certs come through il be getting on my companies ticket and be able to sign my own work off... passing my acs was the hardest thing ive ever done, i defo have a new found respect for any gas eng out there

 

[CES]

You do know that you have to have your own Gas Safe Registration in order to fit boilers as your "own" jobs? To do otherwise using your companies ticket makes you an illegal gas fitter. Unless of course your company has given you full permission to use their registration and will carry the can should anything go wrong.
Get your own ticket and you will find you will gain more respect from the rest of us on here who have been undercut by guys who trade using their day job ticket. While your at it, you should have public liability insurance incase anything goes wrong, if you don't and something goes bang, then you may well end up in jail.

 

[fuzzy]

cheers for the feed back lads much appreciated, its tricky when my head is pulling me one way and what i love doing is pulling me the other, think im defo gonna stick with reniewables now tho until i get right up to speed with all the technologies then assess my situation again then, il leave the plumbing and heating to the weekends, my own jobs like..

steveb - yes i have been fitting boilers without being gas safe, however i have always had a gas safe eng on site to supervise the work i have done and to sign the jobs off, which as i understand is acceptable and legal, that dont matter anymore now tho coz as soon as my acs certs come through il be getting on my companies ticket and be able to sign my own work off... passing my acs was the hardest thing ive ever done, i defo have a new found respect for any gas eng out there

dont understand how you would be gase safe to sign people off without being gas safe or even passed you acs?

 

[unguided1]

I am stunned at this resigned attitude, and the fact there is a need to ask a question like should I do renewables or should I do gas why does there have to be a choice who was it who decided that there had to be a choice, there should be one professional body that you show your qualifications to, with one annual fee why should we be forced to specialise when the appliance only represents only 10% of the whole system, I and I am pretty sure that many people on this forum have a whole wealth of customers some who have gas some who have oil some who have solid fuel and some who have renewables. If you turn up at a customers property and they have an oil boiler and you are gas safe registerd but you have been trained on oil but are not oftec registered do you tell your customer I am sorry but I can not touch that appliance because I am not oftec registered because I am lucky if I see to or three boilers a year and its not cost effective for me to be oftec registerd or do you just get on and sort it out.

So hopefully now people will realise that our industry needs to turned back in favour of a single registration body instead of costly multiple bodies

 

[franz]

This is a goverment issue.
your right unguided.
why cant one body take it on and control it?We can all register,get all the legal stuff from one source,all training questions from one governing body.
And then the customer can be safe and happy.

 

[fuzzy]

i understand but the trade is so diverse now im not sure we will ever get a single body registration

 

[unguided1]

I do not have all the answers and yes it will need some real thought but If there was just one super body even if it was designed for small business and one man bands it would mean that we could reduce our prices a bit to allow us to be more competitve against the cowboys, also to police the industry to protect the customer and the quality of work we already have building control who I have little respect for but If they had a specialised plumbing section with experianced heating engineers policing the industry, any customer who wants any new installation doing would have to contact building control to ensure that the work is done to regulations and all works to be notified what do you guys think would this be workable

The trouble with us english is we are quick to moan about the changes but we never protest, I have never been comfortable at being forced to specialise but then there was never anywhere to voice my frustrations, also the industry has been splintered for so long that I am in danger of sounding like crack pot

 

[PRplumb82]

thanks for feed back lads, dunno why your shocked unguided1 you obviously didnt understand my question, i have recently moved to a new company, the company i now work for rarely does gas work we pretty much only install reniewables, ive trained to become a gas engineer at my former company finally passed my acs and now im not really working on or installing gas appliances ect, i was just seeing what you experienced guys thought and if u thought it was a good move, thats all...

and fuzzy i dont get what your trying to say.. when i was training to become a gas engineer gathering my evidence for acs portfolio i fitted several boilers but i always has a supervising gas safe engineer on site to check over work i had done and sign off the installations for the company i was working for..hope this answers your question

 

[PRplumb82]

CES - sorry forgot to reply, Thanks very much for the advise.. yeah i wont be signing my own work off for a little while yet, my company wont let me sign my own stuff off on their ticket, so for the moment il only be signing work of i do for my company which isnt alot.. so i am gonna look in to getting my own ticket in about 6 months then il be able to fit appliances and sign them off myself. I also already have public liaibility ins..

 

[unguided1]

thanks for feed back lads, dunno why your shocked unguided1 you obviously didnt understand my question, i have recently moved to a new company, the company i now work for rarely does gas work we pretty much only install reniewables, ive trained to become a gas engineer at my former company finally passed my acs and now im not really working on or installing gas appliances ect, i was just seeing what you experienced guys thought and if u thought it was a good move, thats all...

and fuzzy i dont get what your trying to say.. when i was training to become a gas engineer gathering my evidence for acs portfolio i fitted several boilers but i always has a supervising gas safe engineer on site to check over work i had done and sign off the installations for the company i was working for..hope this answers your question

Hi PRplumb82

Yes I did fully understand your question but the point I am making is why should you be forced to choose between gas and renewables you should be able to do both, I understand why, its the physical overall cost that is forcing you to specialise. Now this is not too bad at the moment as you are working for a company and they will be paying for it all but what if in the future you want to go out on your own.

and as for the actual question you asked the government are promoting renewables because if they do not meet their targets by a certain date the UK will be fined by europe so renewables are well worth doing.

 

[tm plumbing]

thanks for feed back lads, dunno why your shocked unguided1 you obviously didnt understand my question, i have recently moved to a new company, the company i now work for rarely does gas work we pretty much only install reniewables, ive trained to become a gas engineer at my former company finally passed my acs and now im not really working on or installing gas appliances ect, i was just seeing what you experienced guys thought and if u thought it was a good move, thats all...

and fuzzy i dont get what your trying to say.. when i was training to become a gas engineer gathering my evidence for acs portfolio i fitted several boilers but i always has a supervising gas safe engineer on site to check over work i had done and sign off the installations for the company i was working for..hope this answers your question

Well done PRplumb82 on passing your acs. my advice would be keep working with your renewable company and see if you can get your solar thermal cert & your heat pumps certs.gain some experience in this field then set up your own company to cover all services,(gas & renewables) who knows you might even be able to sub contract some work from your current employers when you go it alone.
Thats what i,d do as the gas/plumbing industry is not a huge earner at the mo,and staying put for now lets you learn & earn til your ready.

Hope this helps & good luck.

Trev TM Plumbing

 

[fuzzy]

get you now trev, good luck

 

[Kimou]

Hi PRplumb82

and as for the actual question you asked the government are promoting renewables because if they do not meet their targets by a certain date the UK will be fined by europe so renewables are well worth doing.

Is that the 2020 40% commitment? There was the Cancun summit last year when their was talk about the so called fifth fuel, energy you don't use. i.e; insulation, behavioural usage of energy etc. They reckon 10-20% is easily achievable.
I think there has to be some lax in the renewable market so trained plumbers can get piece of the pie. It's the only logical reason for allowing so many new plumbers released into the fray. Cost of PV is coming down fast. Once the gov't starts gettig fined, then they'll take the monopoly away form the big guns or at the very least make it competitve for small businesses. And then we'll all be rolling in it.

 

[unguided1]

Is that the 2020 40% commitment? There was the Cancun summit last year when their was talk about the so called fifth fuel, energy you don't use. i.e; insulation, behavioural usage of energy etc. They reckon 10-20% is easily achievable.
I think there has to be some lax in the renewable market so trained plumbers can get piece of the pie. It's the only logical reason for allowing so many new plumbers released into the fray. Cost of PV is coming down fast. Once the gov't starts gettig fined, then they'll take the monopoly away form the big guns or at the very least make it competitve for small businesses. And then we'll all be rolling in it.

Thats the one and when you go on the electricians forum they appear to be far in advance of us with talk of PV whereas here on the plumbing forum we appear to be extremly slow on the uptake and I blame the fact that our industry is being further splintered by the creation of another expensive and beuracratic regulatory body

 

[Kimou]

I'm not sure, but perhaps they're more advanced due to the stringent statutory laws that came into force. And they've claimed back their industry. We have laws but mainly in gas. And the domestic plumbing goes largely unchecked.
There is a fusion of the trades to be had here. Once it really kicks off they'll be as common as televisions in households. And possibly some legislation will only make the feed-in tariff plausible if it's installed by qualified installers. Like the MCS but without the unaffordable price tag. There was a time when we only had overpriced BT now look. I think it's down to the big boys having first dibs to set up there name and claim massive revenue, then it'll filter down through some loop-hole or pressure group.

 

[Kimou]

There may be the opinion that PV is less obtrusive. As it's only panels and cables, not much has to be done for the install? Running pipes for thermal store or digging massive shafts in your garden is not so appealing along with the uncertainties and debates going on.

 

[unguided1]

or may be its just down to the fact that there is more money to be made from a typical PV install

 

[northcarr]

I did my solar thermal 4yrs ago i thought it was the right thing to do as the goverment were supposed to be forcing new build developments,to have a percentage of renewables fitted that did't happen.To date only managed to do 1 i do think that it is starting to happen at last, but as always with this industry mcs the new corgi to much pappework to much cost for the small trader.I agree with others we need one voice only in this industry :crazy:

 

[Rosie @ CAT]

Hi all,

Good to hear so much support for going into renewables. It is definitely the right area to be in at the mo. With the Green Deal, Renewable Heat Incentive and Feed In Tariffs coming in this year there has been a surge in demand for renewables. This surge is also leading to a surge in demand for qualified, experience installers.

At CAT we can offer you training in renewable technologies to meet the skills demand. We have courses in solar PV, solar thermal, biomass and heat pumps all accredited by C&G, BPEC and the Energy Institute for a full listing please see our online brochure:
CAT Short Courses

We have an incomparible 35 years experience in renewables and working examples of solar PV, solar hot water, CHP & biomass on site, with a full 'mock roof' for use in practicals.

We are currently offering members of the UK Plumbers Forum 15% off our BPEC Solar Hot Water course running from 31st July - 4th August.

To book or for more info please contact [email protected] or 01654 705 952

 

[unguided1]

Hi all,

Good to hear so much support for going into renewables. It is definitely the right area to be in at the mo. With the Green Deal, Renewable Heat Incentive and Feed In Tariffs coming in this year there has been a surge in demand for renewables. This surge is also leading to a surge in demand for qualified, experience installers.

At CAT we can offer you training in renewable technologies to meet the skills demand. We have courses in solar PV, solar thermal, biomass and heat pumps all accredited by C&G, BPEC and the Energy Institute for a full listing please see our online brochure:
CAT Short Courses

We have an incomparible 35 years experience in renewables and working examples of solar PV, solar hot water, CHP & biomass on site, with a full 'mock roof' for use in practicals.

We are currently offering members of the UK Plumbers Forum 15% off our BPEC Solar Hot Water course running from 31st July - 4th August.

To book or for more info please contact [email protected] or 01654 705 952

Hi Rosie

Dont you think it would be more polite to be a UKPF sponsor rather than turning up like a bad smell touting yer wares