Search the forum,

Discuss indirect cylinders versus thermal store efficiency query in the Plumbing Jobs | The Job-board area at PlumbersForums.net

Status
Not open for further replies.
think ill put a "Forum coil" in the tank and use that!! that should heat the UK as well and i can probably export the surplus to russia, i hear its really cold there in the winter.
But seriously, I understand the advise to use a plumber, i take it fully on board and understand its well meant and good advise.
If i knew a good plumber, specialising in this field, who i trusted and could afford, id use him.

Yes i am under engineered, thats why im here.
If as professionals you dont want to give advise to Henry, why allow Henry to join the forum?

My questions are as follows,

Indirect cylinder versus Thermal store ? if the size of tank is to be the same, 350 to 450 liters, are there REAL advantages ( economy, heat management etc) in choosing one over the other?
If i use a thermal store with a plate heat exchanger, can they handle the pressure and flow rate of a 3bar pump? is there a make or type i should consider?
What size heat sync should i consider to dissipate heat in the eventuality of power failure?. the heating circuit is 3/4 inch with 1/2inch spurs, all on one level. i was planning to run 1inch to the sync, which will be below the stove by about 1ft and 15ft away
Do you consider, given the unit cost, that it would be economical to consider retro fitting a laddomat on my oil stove while im at it?
Given i will have a solar coil in the tank before solar is installed, should i put fluid in the coil or will it be OK open until solar is installed. if so what fluid?

I would appreciate if we could move beyond the fact that I'm a tosser who doesn't know what he is doing and should employ a plumber!!

thanks in advance.
 
Not a tosser at all! Tossers don't ask for advice.

U could use solar coil in series with other coil as would just speed up recovery. Will need a good clean if solar fitted. Don't cap leave open with plastic caps to keep dust and rubbish out if not using.

ACV has no coils!

ACV SLME 400l Or slimline sl? ? But speak to rep and they will help with spec and design for free.

Not 100% but slimline sl can go vented?
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Not a tosser at all! Tossers don't ask for advice.

U could use solar coil in series with other coil as would just speed up recovery. Will need a good clean if solar fitted. Don't cap leave open with plastic caps to keep dust and rubbish out if not using.

ACV SLME 400l ? But speak to rep and they will help with spec and design for free.

Acv expensive but defiantly the best

What your doing ain't for the faint hearted but if you think your upto it good luck
Keep us informed
What part of Ireland you from
At least you not got the regulations to worry about
 
How does a unvented thermal store pass building regs?

Sorry my mistake in explanation, they do need to, and thanks for questioning it :) There are special clauses in Part G for both vented and unvented thermal stores, the difference is that for various reasons, the installers (though we do anyway ...) don't have to hold a G3 unvented certificate.

It's because the stores don't have a way of automatically replenishing the water (fluid) in them - they are a sealed system, as such they are considered a part of the central heating system. (They do tend to have large expansion vessels attached :) ) and also inherently they don't have temperature relief valves for the same reason. (pressure release yes, temperature or combined temperature and pressure - no )

Note: In johnnymc's particular instance because he has an uncontrolled heating source - the wood stove, then some part of his system will need to be vented, the easiest way may be to connect it directly and use an vented thermal store (he still gets 'mains pressure' hot water of course) and of course (already presumed this was 'understood') - he'd need to fit a tmv on the ho****er outlet - there are other ways though to still be compliant and of course in Ireland the regs may be different anyway.

With biomass, heat pumps, solar thermal, gas and oil boilers (condensing and not in some cases) et al in a multi fuel environment, there are only a very few people out there that fully understand how to design an effective system with all the correct requirements on flow and return temperatures, then add in the metering requirements for the RHI and you've lost >99% of the boiler fitting companies out there.
 
Last edited:
Sorry my mistake in explanation, they do need to, and thanks for questioning it :) There are special clauses in Part G for both vented and unvented thermal stores, the difference is that for various reasons, the installers (though we do anyway ...) don't have to hold a G3 unvented certificate.

It's because the stores don't have a way of automatically replenishing the water (fluid) in them - they are a sealed system, as such they are considered a part of the central heating system. (They do tend to have large expansion vessels attached :) ) and also inherently they don't have temperature relief valves for the same reason. (pressure release yes, temperature or combined temperature and pressure - no )

Note: In johnnymc's particular instance because he has an uncontrolled heating source - the wood stove, then some part of his system will need to be vented, the easiest way may be to connect it directly and use an unvented thermal store (he still gets 'mains pressure' hot water of course) and of course (already presumed this was 'understood') - he'd need to fit a tmv on the ho****er outlet - there are other ways though to still be compliant and of course in Ireland the regs may be different anyway.

With biomass, heat pumps, solar thermal, gas and oil boilers (condensing and not in some cases) et al in a multi fuel environment, there are only a very few people out there that fully understand how to design an effective system with all the correct requirements on flow and return temperatures, then add in the metering requirements for the RHI and you've lost >99% of the boiler fitting companies out there.

That's what had us confused we was taking about a stove from the outset uncontrolled heat source that's why we was saying vented
 
Hello there, sorry to interrupt - haven't been on here for ages, but nice to be back. Couldn't help but find this business about part g and thermal stores etc interesting - it was something that bothered me in work going back a while so I ended up looking into it a bit. This kind of summarises what I ended up thinking on the matter....


Building Regulations requirements G3 (2) and (3) apply to all stored hot water - including primary vessels, thermal stores, accumulators/buffers in all buildings, irrespective of how they're heated - and that goes for sealed systems and mains fed systems (the only difference is in the prescribed nature of the energy cut out serving the vessel and the use or not of a tprv). The only exception is where the hot water storage is part of an industrial process.


it could well be a bit of a problem for the renewables sector if it did but realise it - my perception is that many seem unaware of the implications of part g (everyone I speak to seems to think its all just about megaflos etc - but it really is quite far reaching). I dare say the building regs will be updated at some point to take into account the changes that have occurred in the technologies being plumbed in to big tanks, but until then, strictly speaking, a lot of biomass stuff for example, doesn't comply with part g.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Reply to indirect cylinders versus thermal store efficiency query in the Plumbing Jobs | The Job-board area at PlumbersForums.net

Creating content since 2001. Untold Media.

OFFICIAL SPONSORS

OFFICIAL SPONSORS

Back
Top
AdBlock Detected

We get it, advertisements are annoying!

Sure, ad-blocking software does a great job at blocking ads, but it also blocks useful features of our website. For the best site experience please disable your AdBlocker.

I've Disabled AdBlock