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Discuss Condensing boiler trap in the Oil and Solid Fuel Forum area at UKPlumbersForums.co.uk.

  1. Bogart

    Bogart Member

    Now I always thought that a condensing boiler needed a condensate trap.
    Was at the back of mine just now and cannot see any trap. There is a 22mm plastic pipe from an outlet marked "condensing outlet" which goes off into a soakaway. It is a Grant Vortex Utility about 10 yrs old.
     
  2. Best

    Best Trusted Plumber

    Definitely has to have a trap and the Vortex boiler would have been supplied with one. Installer must have not bothered using it.
    Boiler fumes could be getting out now.
    The Utility model of about that age and previously, didn’t have the trap installed inside, you were supposed to fit it outside the casing to a wall using the plastic clip supplied.
    Newer Utility Vortex models have the trap in the front, above the burner.
    Buy a new trap from Grant and install it.
     
  3. Bogart

    Bogart Member

    Boiler was installed in the reign of the previous owners so no idea where the trap went. Will sort one asap.
     
  4. ShaunCorbs

    ShaunCorbs S. Mod Trusted Plumber GSR Top Contributor!!

    would it be inside the boiler?
     
  5. Best

    Best Trusted Plumber

    On the Vortex white cased Utility boiler you can’t miss it as the condense trap is just behind the casing front door for the last 10 years. It was not part of the boiler prior to then, but was supplied to fit outside the boiler, usually to be clipped to a wall.
    The Vortex nowadays has the trap inside, at front near burner behind white door, or on the outdoor Vortex module the trap is in the space at rear behind the rear door of module.
    On the boiler house cased Grant boilers, the trap clips to 2 predrilled holes on side of blue boiler case
     
  6. Bogart

    Bogart Member

    No nothing hidden inside. Have seen pics of the ones inside and are fairly obvious. Managed to download a manual for my years model and states one needs adding after the pipework exiting the side of the boiler. So looking on web for cheapest price. Another thing I read in the manual is all the details of the soakaway, even suggesting a soakaway is not a good idea on clay soil only on ground that drains reasonable easy. I'm not sure mine falls under that category!
     
  7. Ric2013

    Ric2013 Plumber

    How close to the house is the soakaway (should be at least 2' away), and have you regularly topped up the limestone chippings in it?
     
  8. Bogart

    Bogart Member

    Best part of a metre away with a decent drop. I have not done anything re the limestone and I doubt has even been looked at since installation.
     
  9. Best

    Best Trusted Plumber

    You could use a soak away trap to bury level with top of ground. Just make one out of a short piece of 110mm soil pipe, with a solvent plug on base and a 110mm to 21mm push in fitting on the top. Then drill a lot of 10mm holes in the pipe, starting from I guess 100mm up and fill some limestone chippings in the base.
     
  10. Bogart

    Bogart Member

    That is what Grant show in their manual. I am assuming, possibly incorrectly, that is what is buried in the ground. I am giving some serious thought to disposing of this condensate by another method.
    The boiler house is some distance from the house near to a field drainage ditch, my field by the way. There is a gulley for rainwater waste going into this ditch I may decide to dump the condensate into this gulley and hence into the drainage ditch. I do not see a problem here as it is over 500m until the ditch does not become my responsibility by which time any condensate will have long gone.
     
  11. Ric2013

    Ric2013 Plumber

    I don't see that a condensate soakaway with the lime chippings, 1 metre away from the house, is going to cause any sort of problem whatsoever. All a soakaway does is hold the water until it can seep into the soil, and it won't be a huge quantity of water anyway. The lime chippings neutralise the acid, as the acid slowly dissolves the chippings. Unless you have a bog where this water goes, I don't see a problem.
    I would tend to disagree with your logic about the ditch though. On the grounds that IF the condensate is a pollutant, it must be going somewhere, even if that is only into the ground - a bit like if I were to pour old engine oil into a soakaway in my own garden it would pollute the water table even if, on the surface, it never were to leave my land - I hope you see where I am coming from.
    What we need now, of course, is to know what the acidic condensate does, and why it is considered necessary to drain it through limestone chippings to neutralise the acid before it drains into the water table. Perhaps the RGIs can throw some light on the subject?
     
  12. Bogart

    Bogart Member

    I can see your logic though I think comparing condensate with engine oil is not totally valid. No amount of water mixed with the engine oil would make it suitable for disposing of in the ground whereas the condensate is acidic, like you not sure in what strength, but will eventually dilute itself by the very nature that the drain collects excess water off the field.
     
  13. SimonG

    SimonG Trusted Plumber

    The early Worcesters were the same with an external trap. Seen a few government installs with the trap not fitted and the company that fitted the boiler no longer trading.
    The warmflow has a semi loose trap so you can move it around in the casing to suit on site requirements.
     
  14. Ric2013

    Ric2013 Plumber

    My point was that I don't understand why the acid is a problem; perhaps it leaches aluminium from the soil or something if not neutralised first and this then is a pollutant, or perhaps it's not a problem at all, and will just prevent the lawn growing properly where it is concentrated and, if so, as you say, not a fair comparison with engine oil. I know gas installers are supposed to put it into a foul or combined sewer, or to a limestone-filled soakaway. What I don't know is the WHY :(
     
  15. Bogart

    Bogart Member

    Just done some reading up re condensate. Apparently from an oil boiler it will be a mixture of nitric and sulpuric acid, gas boiler nitric only. Supposedly it has a pH of 2 to 4 which puts it in the category of matching vinegar, not sure I would want it on my chips though! It seems the big worry is the ability of it to dissolve mortar and metals. Some countries have regs that say it has to be neutralised before one is allowed to dispose of it into a public drain. Anyway will stick with my setup, plus fitting a trap, as there seems to be no adverse effects of it evident yet.
     
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