combustion analysis for noncondensing boiler

[aman1510]

hi,
My portfolio job mentor doesn't do a combustion analysis on noncondensing combi boiler. His opinion was that combustion analysis is only for condensing boiler. As I understand from book knowledge, we have to do on the noncondensing boiler as well. So am I right?

aman

 

[ShaunCorbs]

No you don't have to but most do just for peace of mind

Just have to do it old school

 

[MARTIN LISTER]

Yes, the burner pressure or the gas rate is important.

 

[king of pipes]

As above burner pressure and gas rate all your safety checks , ventillation , flueing, saftey devices , i tend to stick the anylser in to it its a good way of checking the case seal for soundness. Cheers kop

 

[thereisawizza]

I've had a lot of Baxi Solo2/3 boilers come up with horrendous readings after a stripdown service; rang Baxi who practically gave me a bo£&^cking for using the FGA! Said there was no requirement for it and got very stroppy when I accused them of having an inherently dangerous boiler as it produces too much Co!

 

[king of pipes]

I know bud only to well i had to go behind a service engineer who fiddled with the gas valve it nearly came off the wall when it came on the next day frighten the life out of the customer it states in their instructions it is not adjustable , but it is if your dont get it spot on the thing screams like a banshee ended up replacing the gas valve cheers kop

 

[Coheat]

FGA can be used on none condensing boilers, I've used them for years. Old school boilers we used to actually have to drill a hole in the flue to stick the probe in!!!
Use of compressed air and washing down the heat exchanger was quite common on such boilers as Apollo's but yeah, condensing or none condensing they can all be checked with FGA, after 20 years of using them I could'nt not service without using FGA, heck I even stick probe above heat ex when servicing old back boiler units just so I know what is being produced.

 

[Boilers]

Makes me laugh when manufacturers say that, example say you fga 10 potterton suprimas and 9 burning perfect and 1 is of the scale.. There's a reason for that hence why I fill you should fga everything, yet there adimate you shouldn't on non condensing boilers

 

[Gary80gas]

If you do a landlords certificate whether condensing or not they all need fga readings.

 

[jtsplumbing]

If you do Fga on older boilers you will be surprised how clean & efficient some of them are after a strip down service, not has good as condensing units but up in the high 80s for efficiency

 

[Gotcha]

Basically the only difference between them is that condensing ones recirculate the hot gases to extract more heat, hence the cooler running flues. This process will not reduce Co and Co2 particles as a result, neither is condensing mean they have a freaking catalythic converter like cars do. Co and Co2 output will not change if you convert a non condensing boiler to condensing (dont try this). And fga's have a long enough hose for the gases to cool down before they enter the analyser, so shouldnt damage anything inside them.
Your tutor doesnt understand how stuff works, and hes feeding you urban legends. Hes probably regarded as highly knowledgeable, experienced and "knows his stuff". Not.

 

[Best]

I am not gas qualified, but just adding here that analysers have been used for years on non condensing oil boilers (as well as condensing) and no real difference.
FGT is greatly higher on non condensing oil boilers compared with condensing.

 

[AWheating]

You don't need to use a FGA on every appliance to do your job properly. What you must do is follow the appliances instruction, how many non condensing instructions required you to use one?

I'm not saying it's not a good idea to use one but don't get into the mind set that's it's a must, even if your cert has a section for it.

 

[firemant]

If you do a landlords certificate whether condensing or not they all need fga readings.

No they don't. The forms nay have a box for FGA but that does not mean you NEED to do one.
Anywat, how do uou FGA an upper floor boiler withour an internal FGA point?

 

[Atouchofgas]

No they don't. The forms nay have a box for FGA but that does not mean you NEED to do one.
Anywat, how do uou FGA an upper floor boiler withour an internal FGA point?

Hang out the window with a long bit of 8mm pipe

 

[firemant]

The point is ,you do not NEED to do an FGA on a non condensor.

Using a length of 8mm is actually barred by Burley fires, when checking their flueless fires, as the copper can react and distort readings.

BG,when doing their poke and go, DO use a long extension where possible - bit it is not copper

 

[GrahamM]

A lot of employers (especially ones having social housing contracts) will insist on you carrying out FGA analysis on all boilers where it is possible and acting on out of range limits.
A lot of older standard efficiency boilers actually state FGA action limits for servicing. eg. Ferroli modena 80e. And a lot actually provide a FGA test point.

Carying out FGA analysis on all boilers regardless of SE or Zero Governed should be carried out regardless (where practical), in my opinion as it indicates a multitude of issues with fluing, dirty hex/burner etc.
In my opinion it is backward thinking and irresponsible not to use this useful tool!

 

[AWheating]

Problem comes when an engineer uses the FGA to replace parts of the standard service.

The number of engineers I follow that don't even take the case off and just FGA and go is very very high sadly.

 

[London Gas]

I think using a FGA on non-condensing appliances is often used just to save time and customers money by not necessarily needing a full strip down, with a lot of older appliances I find if your ratio is low, a full strip down usually doesn't make a difference, I once went to a Suprima and everything was perfect, good flame, correct bp etc, went outside stuck my FGA in and the readings were through the roof, was caused by small holes in the flue which couldn't be seen, if an FGA wasn't used, I would never have found this.

But as AWheating said people just use the FGA to essentially cut corners and for some unknown reason don't feel the need to check anything else.

I have seen the BG guys using those before, they use silicone tubes and like a telescopic tool.