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Air Source Heat Pumps

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J

jddevel

Hi to All and a Happy New Year. Right thats out of the way.
As a small semi retired developer am shortly about to start building a couple of semis which with new building regulations (2011) requirements getting the build method to pass SAP (Standard Assesment Proceedure) with out pushing the build cost beyond being sensible is difficult. Although gas available even with new boilers am now looking at Air Source Pumps.
I`ve spent much of Xmas wading through info and various threads and have decided my own thread might be the way to go. Each property is just over 100sq.mtrs so not large and with underfloor heating and a high degree of insulation should get requirement down to between 5 and 6kw.absolute maximum. Baring in mind the last few weeks weather your expert thoughts. Also anyone interested in the work? I`m near Plymouth (UK).
 
i believe ASHPs held up well in the cold winter during Jan 2010. I believe there is a MicroGeneration Certification Scheme (MCS) register should reveal local engineers who specialise in your local area! Its something im deseperate to get into!

Also would solar and gas boiler not meet the requirement for 2011. I know they change the goal posts each year and by 2016 all new homes have said to be carbon neutral. And new homes by 2020 can not have a gas appliance fitted.
 
Rodreguez said:
i believe ASHPs held up well in the cold winter during Jan 2010. I believe there is a MicroGeneration Certification Scheme (MCS) register should reveal local engineers who specialise in your local area! Its something im deseperate to get into!

Also would solar and gas boiler not meet the requirement for 2011. I know they change the goal posts each year and by 2016 all new homes have said to be carbon neutral. And new homes by 2020 can not have a gas appliance fitted.
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Thanks Roreguez you`ve helped.
I`m basing my remarks on my sons`information as an engineer who also deals with SAP. The thing is that I have to wear two hats - one a builder who has to comply with current regs. and one as a business that needs to make both a profit and keep build costs as low as possible to enable a competitive selling price of my homes. If an ASHP allows me to avoid higher insulation costs (some of which are going to cause a disposal nightmare if properties are demolished in years to come) and other materials then its the way to go. Trouble is that as one who remembers for example the early days of double glazing rubbish and problems caused by cold spots with incorrect insulation fitting due to poor advice I`m very wary of what TO ME is an untried experience. As I get older I get even more cynical ( if that were possible) and political words like "Think" and "believe" worry me. I like to hear I KNOW from those who know what they are talking about from personal experience. Thanks again.
 
Or try here,based in Devon too.

[DLMURL="http://www.nu-heat.co.uk/index.html"]http://www.nu-heat.co.uk/heat_pumps.html
[/DLMURL]
 
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Hi,

Dont buy budget chinese junk, cheap on the way in but do you really want the customers ringing when it packs in?

There is a reason that - love them or hate them - daikin and mitsi have such a good name. Budget chinese tat can be bought on alibaba dot com for £800 - and I am not advocating that, just saying you get what you pay for,

As with all things Caveat Emptor.........buyer beware!
 
Jerry Hull said:
Hi,

Dont buy budget chinese junk, cheap on the way in but do you really want the customers ringing when it packs in?

There is a reason that - love them or hate them - daikin and mitsi have such a good name. Budget chinese tat can be bought on alibaba dot com for £800 - and I am not advocating that, just saying you get what you pay for,

As with all things Caveat Emptor.........buyer beware!
Click to expand...

Mitsubishi recall heat pumps following Chard explosion (From This is The West Country)
 
Mitsubishi are not chinese, they are manufactured in the UK. Mitsubishi are a japanese company.

They were unfortunate enough to have one third party component fail in one heat pump.... out of over 7000 installed.
 
Looks like the op has been frightened away with the posts

Ps
Daikin are good
Mitsi are good
Danfoss are good

a lot depends on the requirement you have try contacting your preferred choice or even any of them most will provide a site survey foc
 
Where are you getting the , no gas after 2020????

I very much doubt that considering the oil/gas industry in the north sea. Doesnt make any sense


Rodreguez said:
i believe ASHPs held up well in the cold winter during Jan 2010. I believe there is a MicroGeneration Certification Scheme (MCS) register should reveal local engineers who specialise in your local area! Its something im deseperate to get into!

Also would solar and gas boiler not meet the requirement for 2011. I know they change the goal posts each year and by 2016 all new homes have said to be carbon neutral. And new homes by 2020 can not have a gas appliance fitted.
Click to expand...
 
smillsey said:
Where are you getting the , no gas after 2020????

I very much doubt that considering the oil/gas industry in the north sea. Doesnt make any sense[/QUOT

i read somewhere the government is aiming to do this. not in exsisting homes just new builds. doesn't stop you replacing any gas appliance tho
Click to expand...
 
from what i have researched on ashp they work very well when the outside air has enough heat in to extract but as that outside air temperature lowers they become less and less efficient. unfortunately this is also the time when you need the most heat put into the building.
with new regs comming in on recovering heat from extracted air i think ashp will be used in conjunction with mechanical heat recovery ventilation and be far more commonplace as the technology is so similar (combined unit ?)
my thoughts are ashp will also be used with traditional boilers as a top up so that at extremes of low temp (winter) there will not be a problem with efficiency

as for the north sea thing i was informed by one of the instructors on my recent gsr refresher that they are using one of the old north sea gas fields as a storage facility for gas from Scandinavia for the UK market so gas will be around in the UK for a long time to come
 
As Thomas said, a exhaust air heat pump will work a treat. Dependant on the size of the property a 360P will do most a 2/3 bedroom, small house.

It works really well with underfloor heating aswell. I really like the units, they combine all in one unit a unvented cylinder, heating cylinder, ventilation unit, compressor.

They weigh a tonne though, around 300kg!
 
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Hi have just done a new build using the mitsibishi air source unit, we found it really struggled when the outside air temp was minus 5 or lower, ground floor of the building we used underfloor heating, upstairs normal radiators which have to be increased in size due to the low flow temp,
am not totally convinced on these units as yet but time will tell, and no doubt these units will improve over time.
 
Just got back from Daikins factory in Belgium and witnessed air to water heat pumps working at minus 25. They work perfectly well at extreme temps. The secret is in the sizing of the unit. Be aware that ALL outputs of ASHP are quoted at plus 7 deg so if you heat loss comes to say 8Kw the unit you need to work at minus 3 would be something like a 11 or 14Kw unit. A registered Daikin installer would be able to advise on size of unit as they have a software programme to select the correct unit.
Mitsubishi units are good but have had a bad press recently due to a problem with a unit as described earlier.
 
Hi Gents,

I have commissioned a fair few Heat pumps now for installation companies. Our company (And me are Fgas registered) and can vouch for both the Daikin Altherma and mitsubishi Ecodan,

The great thing about the mitsi is it has "generic" parts like the pump is a "normal" pump etc,

whereas the daikin has its own parts and they MUST be fitted to maintain warranty.

Both offer excellent COP in low temps, a lot more info is available on fridge forums...
 
mitsubishi ecobang says it all
Nibe 360 Ive got 2 of those in me yard less than 18 months old ripped out of 2 council houses and replaced with gas boilers because they cost to much to run, probably had something to do with the massive immersions in them
 
The 360's are good units, just way to complex for social housing. The new NIBE 370 is something to behold, it looks bloody good and has a simple but very detailed menu system.

The 360 can go upto 8kw with immersions, you can turn them down though in the menus.

I'm starting to sound like I work for NIBE! I don't honest :p
 
Hi tweakyboy

You have hit the nail on the head yer average customer has no interest in driving their domestic hot water system or their heating system they just want to come home to a warm house and hot water with as little fuss as possible and as cheap as possible, in this case the Nibe unit failed miserably
regards

Mike
 
unguided1 said:
Hi tweakyboy

You have hit the nail on the head yer average customer has no interest in driving their domestic hot water system or their heating system they just want to come home to a warm house and hot water with as little fuss as possible and as cheap as possible, in this case the Nibe unit failed miserably
regards

Mike
Click to expand...

Answering my own quote, having stripped down the 2 nibe 360s If Nibe want to know what is wrong with the 360 then for a small exorbitant fee I would be happy to speak to their designers to explain the huge error in their design, and its hardly a big fault more a miscalculation
 
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