DIY Gas Fitting

[dosters]

Originally Posted by stuart010378

DIY Gas fitting is also Illegal, and unless you are CORGI regestered you would even be able to buy the parts.

Totally Agree with Stuart

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Home Automation, Zigbee, Smart Energy from Vesternet.com

[Bernie2]

I was CORGI registered before I retired and had all the then current ACOPS.

But what people never say, is why the whole registration issue came about. Namely what happened at Ronan Point.

The industry undoubtedly needed bringing up to date, but as I recall I don't think there where all that many more gas accidents before the registration scheme came about than there where afterword.

And anyway, how about electricity? That is still largely unregulated and how many accidents happen with that?

As I said, I am all for registration and qualification, but the prices have to come down for those courses. Small firms and individuals can struggle to afford to pay for a full set of ACS every five years. And if registration is for safety reasons, it makes sense to make courses that help qualify you for registration, as cheap as possible to get as many people registered as possible.

But then if the courses are too cheap the colleges will drop the courses. I would say lets have an industry wide levy on all involved in the industry, to pay to keep the course fees down and the colleges open.
It seems to me that gas supply companies rake in millions if not billions, surely they can spare a few bob to help those who make it possible for people to safely use gas?

You could even have a levy on gas prices of say 1/000 of a p per therm and open new collages. I feel sure the punter would not mind, even perhaps throw in free gas checks for everybody, paying the contractor from the levy.

All together you could probably make the courses free and help gas safety no end.

Oh! Aye what about the water companies as well?

Trust a scouser to cause trouble!!

[migoplumber]

all work on gas, be it lpg or natural, is covered by "the gas safety (installation and use) regulations (GSIUR) 1998.

quote 3.1
"no person shall carry out any work in relation to a gas fitting or gas storage vessel unless he is competent to do so"
quote 3.3 (partial)
no employer, employee or self employed person shall carry out any such work unless the employer, employee or self employed person as the case may be IS a member of a class of persons approved for the time being by the health and safety executive"

the approved body was corgi.
now the approved body is the gas safe register

from the fifth edition GIUSP
"competance in gas safe installation work requires gas operatives to have enough knowledge, practical skill and experience to carry out the job in hand safely, with due regard to good working practice. knowledge must be kept up to date with awareness of changes in law, technology and safe working practice"

now you have to interpretate that!
my view is i can prove my competance, however without your ACS's you are unable to join an approved body... therfore unable to work on any gas installations!!

you can read the gas regs on line from most librarys. its a mind gobbling read, and some points are still open to interpretation, and there are exceptions.

shaun

[Bernie2]

Hmm!

The thing is, GasSafe registration as far as I have read does not ask for ACS's.

They have gone back to the old CORGI assessment method of going out and looking at your jobs to see whether you know what your doing or not.

Basically isn't that what an ACS's does but in a classroom?

DIYers as far as I am aware can do gas work in their own home, if they are competent to do so, providing its not for money. As to proving the competence of a DIYer well that is another thing.

I doubt you will ever stop it either, because if you brought in laws banning what a person can do in their own home, your on the dodgy ground of state control of the individuals freedoms.

If the DIYer caused harm to another through the incompetent installation or repair of gas works in their own home, then under the law they are responsible and can be fined and imprisoned the same as a gas engineer can.

But if he or she competently installs stuff and it accords to the Gas Regs there is nothing you can do about it.

As to selling gas spares! Well you may be able to buy them, but you can't fit them. The onus passes from the seller to the buyer. So really they should be freely available to anybody.

Don't forget gas fires and cookers. Who chooses them and buys them? I would say house wives or home husbands not gas fitters. And nobody is going to buy a cooker or fire from a gas fitter if they don't have too, why would they want too and possibly pay extra for the handling?

The sad fact is, you hear on the news about all the rip offs that are going on. One woman not so long ago paid something like £150 for a new £2.50 thermocouple change job.

So unless gas fitters can sell the goods cheaper than buying from a shop, will people buy from them?

On balance I think the GasSafe scheme is a good idea. Make it simple and easy for anybody to join and get their work inspected. If a DIYer does a job, let them get it certified by GasSafe for a small set fee. It would make more work for all the gas industry that way.

[Jason.S]

We have a similar issue with Part P. Anyone can do electrical work anywhere, providing they can prove competence, and one way is registering with a scheme.

Only trouble is there are 5 schemes to join and they are all competing against each other.

NICEIC are winning still, but only just.

[Bernie2]

Yes its the same kind of thing Jason.

The problem is if you start restricting the sale of gas goods to only certain classes of people. Then the boiler manufacturers may restrict their goods and spares to their own people. And keep installation information to themselves. That would mean not only would the general public have to ask the manufactures to fit their boilers but also repair and service it. That would leave many in the industry without work, especially small companies and self employed guys as well as probably higher the prices for everyone.

[david williams]

the word compedent sums it up,in court no one wants to say what it means.because you dont hold a peice of paper to say you are competent does not mean you are not .as with most gas appliences if you can read the manufacturers instructions and comply with them you are not incompetant.i have never seen anyone who has done gas work in there own house who has been prosecuted even when the work was dangerous.in the end corgi do not take you to court the hsa do and then but rarely.

[flat pack]

as quoted the girls don't need acs/gas safe hsa 3.1

quote 3.1
"no person shall carry out any work in relation to a gas fitting or gas storage vessel unless he is competent to do so"


the other quote about fees
why cant local state colleges run these acs like the city and guilds at normal rates

[Plouasne]

Lets play Devils advocate here, just assume that I am a competent person, have Qualigaz certificate for both gaz natural and GPL, I don't hold any UK qualifications, but under EU rules, I can do gas fitting in the UK, I forget the actual text and numbers now, but its like this if the examining body in the member state where I took and passed my examination has rules as stringent or more so than the member state I am working in, its two fingers to CORGI or who ever they are now, the only thing I might have to have done is have a sworn translation of my papers from the member states language in to English, its under the free movement of labour and goods

Qualigaz do exams in English and the last time I looked they were a lot cheaper the the UK's fees, the only thing with Qualigaz is they do not accept soft soldering, its got to be hard solder with a minimum of 8% silver content

Also when I was working in the UK, I had a direct order from a company director, to turn on the gas, because it was the old persons Christmas dinner in the church hall, even if the gauge dropped like a stone 5 inches water gauge, (i couldn't get it to go higher) in less than 30 seconds, between a rock and a hard place, I got the sack indirectly for refusing the order

Qualigaz, is a non profit making organisation, (under French law made in 1901)
a couple of websites for you to have a look at, the first one has side bars which can be clicked on for other pages, the second one shows all the courses they run and the costs, sorry that its all in French, but do not worry, because 40% of the English verbs are the same as French verbs, the pictures will speak a lot louder though

Certificat de conformité Gaz - Qualigaz

http://www.qualigaz.com/Cata_Qualigaz_09_BD.PDF

[ian4147]

just to say my piece i am only just getting into plumbing and nothing to do with gas at all but someone i know moved the piping and meter in there house after they built there extension for the simple fact he had that little trust in work men and council workers (ex council property) because of shody work done in the past that he point blank refused to pay someone for crap work when he did a very good job himself he did all the plumbing and gas himself and 15 years on has had no problems at all after being an engineer in his younger days he was adament he would make a better job.to be honest i find that i do all work generally in my home(we dont have gas) but to be honest even if its something ive never tackled before i have more faith in my own work than some of the cowboys ive seen over the years (not plumbing but in general) and i am happy with my work which is more than can be said for the repairs i need to make to the jobs other people have done in recent months!!!