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Can you sign off an installation done by a non-GSR plumber?

Discuss Can you sign off an installation done by a non-GSR plumber? at UK Plumbers Forums; lets say he had signed off a completely safe, well installed appliance. Would he still be prosecuted? It isnt that he signed off someone elses work, its that he signed ...
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    Default Re: Can you sign off an installation done by a non-GSR plumber?

    lets say he had signed off a completely safe, well installed appliance. Would he still be prosecuted?

    It isnt that he signed off someone elses work, its that he signed off someone elses dangerous work.
    Last edited by SteveWannadoGas; 03-12-2016 at 11:32 PM.

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    Default Re: Can you sign off an installation done by a non-GSR plumber?

    No but why should he be signing off rather than doing
    IMPORTANT: Carbon Monoxide can be produced when ANY fuel is burnt, including oil, gas, wood and coal.


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    Default Re: Can you sign off an installation done by a non-GSR plumber?

    thats a separate issue.

    the point is, hes perfectly ok to sign off any work he wants to, but its his name on the line and if the job isnt up to scratch, then its him who will be answerable for that.

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    Default Re: Can you sign off an installation done by a non-GSR plumber?

    Yes but point being he shouldn't have to
    IMPORTANT: Carbon Monoxide can be produced when ANY fuel is burnt, including oil, gas, wood and coal.


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    Default Re: Can you sign off an installation done by a non-GSR plumber?

    Quote Originally Posted by SteveWannadoGas View Post
    thats a separate issue.

    the point is, hes perfectly ok to sign off any work he wants to, but its his name on the line and if the job isnt up to scratch, then its him who will be answerable for that.
    What is it you are failing to understand here?

    Well installed or not is a moot point. Signing off an installation by someone who is not a gsr is illegal and could lead to you both being prosecuted.

    You say you want to do gas, Steve.

    That means you are prepared to spend a good bit of time and a fair bit of money becoming trained and registered.

    Why risk it all by covering the aris of someone who not only cannot be bothered to get themselves trained and qualified but is also making a mockery of the industry in general and taking the absolute rise out of you in particular?
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    Default Re: Can you sign off an installation done by a non-GSR plumber?

    Cheers cropster long day and very tired so may not have given this the advice it deserves but gas Safe registered or not do the right thing
    Last edited by Riley; 04-12-2016 at 12:26 AM.
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    IMPORTANT: Carbon Monoxide can be produced when ANY fuel is burnt, including oil, gas, wood and coal.


    GSR? Want gas safety or boiler repair advice? We will check out that you're genuine via the gas safe website, so please dont be offended when we ask for your details. DIYers, odd job people and have a go heroes need not apply.

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    Default Re: Can you sign off an installation done by a non-GSR plumber?

    As above. The legal position regarding this is well documented - as are the consequences once found out.

    Just about every scenario you can think of has been prosecuted - as well as a recent gsr (gas safe magazine) case with an engineer signing mates work off.

    All it took was a customer complaint - gas safe became involved. Names were taken and asses hauled. They all hung each other - suspended prison sentences and fines enough to make a glass eye water..
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    Default Re: Can you sign off an installation done by a non-GSR plumber?

    Cheers Phil. Get sick of explaining it. Deaf ears and all that!!!!
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    IMPORTANT: Carbon Monoxide can be produced when ANY fuel is burnt, including oil, gas, wood and coal.


    GSR? Want gas safety or boiler repair advice? We will check out that you're genuine via the gas safe website, so please dont be offended when we ask for your details. DIYers, odd job people and have a go heroes need not apply.

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    Default Re: Can you sign off an installation done by a non-GSR plumber?

    To stick my head above the parapet, I think the problem is that there are too many RGIs (by which, to be clear, I don't mean a majority) whose work ethic is not significantly better than someone less qualified. This probably includes the person who would knowingly sign off someone else's work. The effect is that when an RGI turns up, there is not always the obvious difference there should be.

    In an ideal world, every RGI would show up and be an obviously highly dedicated and trained professional with excellent communication skills whose work would be beyond criticism and would look good and hence impress even those whose knowledge stops them being able to appreciate the finer points. In practice, as with every trade, some do sloppy (not necessarily dangerous) work or are generally hamfisted.

    But because it costs so much money to be an RGI (and here is the crux of my complaint), RGIs cost a lot more. It's not that RGIs are raking it in, but they have to pay a lot of fees and possibly these are excessive, and I suspect someone in the training/regulatory industry IS raking it in.

    You will understand my point of view if you think that when I did my IPAF MEWPs training, I sat a practice multiple choice exam which I passed, then we did an hour's study and then took the _exact same_ exam again and I don't really think I learnt a lot. A couple of hours of practical and I had my certificate. Of course, because I requested familiarisation of the machinery before I used it (an IPAF requirement), I was never actually employed as a MEWP driver and thus I never got any return on my £180. Education or jobs for the boys?

    So, to the untrained, an RGI is not always seen as better, (s)he just costs more.

    I can well understand why someone with a good work ethic and pride would refuse to put his/her name to work carried out by others, but sadly qualifications are not the gold standard they should be and often genuine RGIs are probably strapped for cash (and trying to be nice) and take the attitude that if the install looks perfect, probably it is.

    After all, I've run gas pipe under observation of a gas fitter, but obviously he wasn't looking over my shoulder at every stage of every joint on the pipe run. If he had been there would have been little point in using my labour instead of his own - there had to be an element of trust that I would to continue to work exactly as instructed and shown and not, say, switch from Everflux to LaCo half way through the job. So the difference between this situation and signing off someone else's work can, slowly and incrementally, become one of degrees.

    However, as Croppie has pointed out, it seems from reading this thread that the law is pretty clear - it isn't legal to sign off someone else's work. Would I be right to assume that the reason SteveWannaDoGas is able to find this a debatable point is that a person signing off someone else's work would probably not have been pulled up on it if the work had been safe, although this does not change the law.
    Last edited by Ric2013; 04-12-2016 at 12:51 AM.
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    Default Re: Can you sign off an installation done by a non-GSR plumber?

    I think what you are saying is there is good and bad in everything ??

    However the sort of supervised scenario you describe is still technically illegal but if no ones looking well there ya go youve got away with it amd your quids in.
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    Default Re: Can you sign off an installation done by a non-GSR plumber?

    No, what I am saying is that a lot of education and regulation is about making more excuses for posh rich people to make more money and to look more puffed up and pompous.

    "However the sort of supervised scenario you describe is still technically illegal but if no ones looking well there ya go youve got away with it and your quids in." Well, not really quids in, but I got some valuable work experience and helped out the guy who was giving me that experience: that was more the point. Who really believes apprentices are always going to be in the same room as the boss?

    Hang on... police at the door...
    Last edited by Ric2013; 04-12-2016 at 01:04 AM.
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    Default Re: Can you sign off an installation done by a non-GSR plumber?

    If thats your take on education - whatever, im not gonna change your concieted view.

    However gas regulations are there to protect people from themselves amd to ensure recognised safe working practices.
    If you mess up with gas - you don't get many second chances.
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